Extending the CMAA's activities to support musicians and clergy in ministry to Spanish-speaking communities was a hot topic this year, with Fr. Arthur Rojas (New York) appealing at the CMAA general meeting for initiatives in this area. Dr. Mahrt, as president, said that a committee of members would be formed for precisely this purpose, and volunteers for it are not just welcome, but necessary.

One source of plainchant on Spanish texts will be Prof. Paul Ford's future Spanish edition of "By Flowing Waters", which has been in the works for some time.

Este es sitio con propios y otros textos para descargar.

Misal Palm: Ediciones Latinoamerica y Española

Propios de la Misa (tres meses)
Misas Votivas (todos)
Misas Comunes (todos)

This is a site with propers and other texts for download.

Misal Palm: Latin American and Spanish editions. (Mobile palm missal)

Mass propers in Spanish (3 months)
Votive Masses (all)
Commons of Saints (all)

What about something like this:

Would like to find a setting of the Entrance Antiphon for Aug. 15 in Spanish. Checked the sites listed above, but couldn't find any music, just texts.

This whole project is so badly needed. A Spanish SEP - SSP - would do an amazing amount of good, along with practice videos too.

Pancho: You have made a wonderful attempt! Can you email me? I'd like to chat more with you about this idea if you'd like.

@benedictgal:

Right, I have the approved books which we use at our parish, and this has been my source material so far.

Can you explain this more:

"The USCCB recently approved the Spanish-language propers for our own Spanish-language translation of the Roman Missal. They sent the Spanish-language propers to the CDWDS for its recognitio."

Is this the Mexican Missal translation? Or a new one?

Very good to know, Paul. Thank you. Any idea when and if this might come back with recognitio?

And what about a Lectionary? Any foreseen changes here?

Adam wrote:

Pancho: You have made a wonderful attempt! Can you email me? I'd like to chat more with you about this idea if you'd like.

Thanks, Adam. I've already sent you an email.

I know what you mean about the Spanish liturgical books. I'm still learning, too (and I really ought to know more by now). I know of at least 2 missals editions, the current Mexican one and another that I believe is used in Argentina. I assume there must be a third one used in Spain. I don't know how much overlap exists between these editions beyond the Ordinary of the Mass. I also know of at least 2 lectionaries, the current Mexican one and the "Hispanoamericana" edition. I'm not sure if there is or are another one or other ones used in Spain or elsewhere.

This makes it very difficult when looking for the readings online, most of the time the sites that have them don't say which edition for which countries they are using, or at least they hide the information very well. On the other hand, these sites are often more thorough than the USCCB one. They'll include not just the scripture readings but also the missal antiphons, the collect, the prayer over the gifts and the concluding prayer. Often the prayers of the faithful too. I'm not sure what the source is for those.

Can I just add that I'm deeply, deeply, deeply annoyed that the USCCB sounds like it intends on having it's own Spanish missal? I think we really don't need another Spanish edition right now, in addition to all the existing ones. There are better ways they could be spending their energies.

Edited to add:
A couple of things I'd like to know more about are about the bible translations behind the lectionaries and the psalters used. For instance, the psalms I used above are from the Liturgy of the Hours. They match the ones in the Leccionario Hispanoamericano but are different from the ones in the Mexican lectionary. Appearantly, they are also the same as the ones in the lectionary from Spain. Does that mean the Leccionario Hispanoamericano is the same as the lectionary from Spain or do they just share the same psalter? Either way, I prefer these psalms to the ones in the Mexican lectionary, and it's nice when the psalms at Mass match the psalms in the Liturgy of the Hours.

Benedictgal,
are we talking about the same lectionary? The one I'm familiar with has a green cover and was being used at my parish for weekday masses. As I've said its psalter matches (more or less) the one used in the Liturgy of the Hours as well, it seems, as the one used in the lectionary from Spain.

I also liked the readings better. The ones in the Mexican lectionary use simpler and (in my opinion) clunkier language. Could you be thinking of the Biblia Latinoamericana? I know that translation of the bible has gotten some criticims for its notes.

Dr. Ford's Red Flat caught, I wonder about an independent translation into Spanish of the Graduale propers.

Pancho, I live down here in the South Texas hinterland. The upshot is that we can, depending on how safe the other side is on a given day, cross over into Mexico and buy the three-volume set. Our religous goods store also gets it from Mexico.

To my very limited knowledge, I do not know if Mexico has anything remotely similar to a musical setting for the propers as we do with the SEP. The few times that I have been to Mass in Mexico, it's always hymns (and, sadly, badly written ones). I need to borrow a Roman Missal from Mexico to see what their propers look like.

As for the US having its own Spanish-language Roman Missal, this could very well be a good thing. We need to remember that while the United States has a huge Hispanic population, not all of them are of Mexican origin. There are many who hail from Cuba, Central America and South America. It's not just all about Our Lady of Guadalupe, as these other regions also have their particular Marian devotions as well as patron saints.

However, you forgot one huge detail: the Mexican Spanish-language translation of the Roman Missal is outdated because we are now in the third typical edition of the Roman Missal. This needs to be re-worked under the guidelines of Liturgicam Authenticam. The USCCB has had a group working on this. In fact, in 2004, they met down here in Laredo to work on the translation, using LA as their guide.

Furthermore, I take issue with the approach that each diocese in the United States should choose its own Spanish translation of the books. Whatever happened to unity? This goes beyond copyright issues, Pancho. Granted, I am not a huge fan of a lot of what the USCCB has done regarding liturgy; however, there are a few times when the light bulb has lit up over their heads and this is one of them.

However, the Hispanoamericano Lectionary was never meant for liturgical use, as it is tinged with Liberation Theology. That is what the USCCB found very problematic with it.

Furthermore, there is a group in the USCCB working on the Spanish-language translation. Last I heard, one of the members of the group is the diocesan director of worship for the Archdiocese of San Antonio, who had also been working on it when he served as our own diocesan director of worship.

The group has to abide by the guidelines of Liturgiam Authenticam. I do not think that they are "re-inventing" the wheel, so to speak; however, since there is a third typical edition of the Roman Missal, the Spanish-language versions need to be revised to reflect that change.

Pancho, I heard this directly from Msgr. Moroney himself, who, if we recall, was the Secretary to the former Bishops Committee on Liturgy. His explanation was that the "blue" and "orange" books were meant as study and not as a lectionary. He told us that the ones we were to use were from Mexico. Just because Liturgical Press sells something, that may not necessarily mean that it is okay for use in the Liturgy, as I later found out with their Passion proclamation booklets.

As for Liturgiam Authenticam, it covers ALL liturgical books, not just the Roman Missal. As far as the United States working on its own translation, I frankly do not see a problem with having our own Spanish-language version of the Roman Missal. This Missal, if I understand correctly, will take into account some of the various feasts celebrated by Hispanics who are other than Mexican in origin (Puerto Ricans, Cuabans, South Americans, Central Americans, etc). They also need to have the American adaptations (Blessed Kateri Tekakwitha, St. John Neumann, Thanksgiving Day and other primarily American celebrations).

No, Pancho, he was not. I am well aware of what the liturgical books look like. I am not stupid. The blue and orange books are hard-covered and resemble lectionaries. The orange one was for Sundays while the blue ones were for daily Mass. In fact, I saw the orange one at the local hopsital chapel sacristy (this book is not in use). Pancho, Msgr. Moroney told us that these books were not meant for use in the United States. He told us that we needed to use the ones approved for Mexico. That is why, as soon as I returned home from the conference and reported it to the bishop and our diocesan director of worship, we immediately implemented the use of the correct books. Just because something may have been used elsewhere for 20 years does not mean that it was correct.

Unlike you, I do not have a problem with the USCCB having an edition of the Spanish-language Roman Missal for use in the United States. Copyright restrictions exist for other translations as well, so this is not merely a USCCB thing. In fact, might I remind you that the copyright for the English translation of the Roman Missal is actually for ICEL. It is better to have one book that takes into account everything than to have several different Spanish-language Missals floating around. Furthermore, you also need to take into account that there are feasts and celebrations that are unique to the United States. Try having a Mass on Thanksgiving Day in Spanish when there is nothing in the Mexican Roman Missal that sounds like our American adaptation.

As far as the lectionary itself being translated, this is where the copyright becomes an issue for the USCCB. The current lectionary that we have right now is a bad translation. Why? It uses the RNAB as its base. Other English-speaking national conferences have better translations. Even the Carribbeans use the RSV-CE, which is a far superior translation to what we have.

The reference to the Liberation Theology issue comes from a direct statement by Msgr. Moroney made at the conference. I was present when he stated that.

I have several cycles of Spanish Psalm responses for Weekdays, if anyone is interested.

If anybody needs a Spanish communion chant for tomorrow, here's the gabc file for one adapted from the Graduale Simplex for the day:

name:Exaltación de la Santa Cruz;
commentary: adaptación del Graduale Simplex;
user-notes: Antífona de la comunión;
annotation:VIIIc;
%%
(c4)Por(j) la(j) se(j)ñal(jkj) de(j) la(j) Cruz(jij) *(,) de(j) nues(j)tros(h) e(j)ne(j)mi(ih)gos(gh) (;) lí-(fh)bra(vjh)nos(ij), Dios(hh) nues(g)tro(g) (::)

Here are the psalm verses, taken from Psalm 2, translation is the Torres Amat version (19th c.).

Salmo 2: 1;2;3;4;6;7;8; 11, 13(b)

1.    ¿Por qué causa se han embravecido las naciones, * y los pueblos maquinan vanos proyectos?

2.   Hanse coligado los reyes de la tierra; † y se han confederado los príncipes contra el Señor, * y contra su Cristo.

3.   Rompamos, dijeron, sus ataduras, * y sacudamos lejos de nosotros su yugo.

4.   Mas Aquel que reside en los cielos se burlará de ellos; * se mofará de ellos el Señor.

5.   Mas yo he sido por él constituido rey sobre Sión, * su santo monte, para predicar su Ley.

6.   A mi me dijo el Señor: Tú eres mi hijo *: Yo te engendré hoy.

7.   Pídeme, y te daré las naciones en herencia tuya, * y extenderé tu dominio hasta los extremos de la tierra.

8. Servid al Señor con temor, † y regocijaos en él poseidos siempre de un temblor santo. * Bienaventurados todos aquellos que ponen en él su confianza.




Because this old translation was done from the Vulgate, it uses "Cristo"(Christ) in line 2. If you like you can switch that for "Mesías" or "Messiah" (added in italics in the Torres Amat) or use "ungido"(anointed) instead as a modern translation might.

I've sung these at my parish for the past few weeks, as seasonal antiphons for the Entrance and Communion. Surprisingly the people have been joining in with some success!

bump

sorry to hear that, benedictgal ... pretty close to the same here too.

I think this is the link you're looking for...
http://www.chantforever.com/mass-music/easter-proper-in-spanish/

Claire, that is probably one of the few bright spots in Flor y Canto and United In Christ, but, these are very small glimpses. At least the faithful are starting to catch on to this beautiful chant. I've used it every Sunday during Lent, as well as on Ash Wednesday.

I'd appreciate it if someone could update this thread with any progress that (hopefully) has been made toward making a collection of Spanish language Propers. Many thanks!