Choir doesn't like singing often
  • ian_udell
    Posts: 31
    My Schola started two years ago and I have been trying to build it up since then. We started with singing all the Propers IN - CO and including one hymn or easy piece of polyphony. We practiced about once every other week and sang for every Holyday of Obligation and other special Masses (Candlemas, Holy Week, etc.). Before then, there was no choir, the choir that we had dissolved during COVID. So I was building a parish choir when there was no other.

    This year I have tried to make them more of a regular parish choir and sing about 2 times per month. I am receiving pushback about practicing weekly and singing often. They say that weekly practices and the amount of music we are learning is too much. Is singing 16 times per year really too much?

    This is how many times we are singing:
    Aug - 2 Masses
    Sep - 2 Masses and Solemn Vespers
    Oct - 1 Mass
    Nov - 3 Masses
    Dec - 2 Masses and Caroling
    Jan - 0 Masses - Break
    Feb - 0 Masses
    Mar - 3 Masses (+1 optional Mass)
    Apr - 0 Masses
    May - 2 Masses
    Jun - Break
    Jul - Break

    They have a relatively easy time with chant, but chant is not their favorite. So I include one piece of polyphony and one SATB hymn per time we sing to appease them.

    Am I doing too much, or is this just a classic case of parish aversion to change?
  • SponsaChristi
    Posts: 855
    If I joined a parish choir I would expect to sing every Sunday, solemnity, Ash Wednesday, the Triduum, and anything else that comes up. I would also expect weekly rehearsals at the minimum as well as extra longer rehearsals during Lent and Advent. Furthermore, I would expect to be expected to practice at home and be prepared to rehearse at rehearsal.

    Back when I was in my Latin Mass Choir and schola there were weeks where I spent more time at church than at home because of choir.

    By having more frequent rehearsals and singing more frequently at Mass, it will make it easier and faster to learn more repertoire in the long run because it will always be fresh in their memory.
    Thanked by 6novusgordo tomjaw probe trentonjconn WGS CHGiffen
  • probe
    Posts: 253
    Amateur singers would surely need plenty of rehearsals to cope with SATB polyphony, though hymns should be easier. Do they have rehearsal aids to practice at home? Is there a core of interested singers who want to sing any chance they get?

    If they have to travel to week evening rehearsals, could you try offering alternate weekday and Sunday-after-Mass rehearsals if there is at least an hour's gap between Masses? I assume they are always present at Mass, so not singing half the time does look odd. What happens when they don't sing as a group, does an organist lead the congregation hymns and they sing as part of the congregation?
    If a significant number are working, they will only be available on Sundays, so not for example the Triduum.
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,813

    If they have to travel to week evening rehearsals, could you try offering alternate weekday and Sunday-after-Mass rehearsals if there is at least an hour's gap between Masses


    A nonstarter for families who need regularity and for those who expect to have a social life. I’d skip an after Mass rehearsal on principle if it was a regular occurrence: I want a separation from the liturgy and the next rehearsal, in addition to losing out significantly on social opportunities.


    If a significant number are working, they will only be available on Sundays, so not for example the Triduum.


    Lame. Take leave or make use of provisions for evening Masses.


    If I joined a parish choir I would expect to sing every Sunday, solemnity, Ash Wednesday, the Triduum, and anything else that comes up. I would also expect weekly rehearsals at the minimum as well as extra longer rehearsals during Lent and Advent. Furthermore, I would expect to be expected to practice at home and be prepared to rehearse at rehearsal.


    Yes. We are cutting back, probably, both schola-only and choral Masses, but we sing virtually every Sunday, holy day, most major feasts (I class/solemnity), and during Holy Week from the Assumption to June. (We never have Ash Wednesday, though I’d be fine with it at 6 AM the first point aside.)

    Rehearsals are at the same time, and ideally in the same place, on the same day, as well as before services (which for the section with the most volunteers alleviates some problems). We try to rehearse what we can with just male voices at schola practice. We make as many videos as possible.

    Ian, unfortunately your situation is not unusual in that volunteers are getting harder and harder to find, but this is an extreme case.
    Thanked by 2novusgordo tomjaw
  • Musicguy57
    Posts: 28
    People's lives are very busy. I encourage you to be thankful for their dedication and enjoy when are able to perform. I have been in parishes where this would have been like manna from heaven. It may change over time. You never know.
    Thanked by 1davido
  • ServiamScores
    Posts: 3,390
    We sing every week when we are in season, so the schedule you've outlined seems beyond generous to me. I have two section leaders, while everyone else in the choir is volunteer.
    Thanked by 2novusgordo tomjaw
  • novusgordo
    Posts: 44
    Quoth @Musicguy57:
    People's lives are very busy. I encourage you to be thankful for their dedication and enjoy when are able to perform. I have been in parishes where this would have been like manna from heaven. It may change over time. You never know.
    (leaving aside my objections to the term "perform" in a liturgical context)
    To a certain extent, I can see this applying to rehearsals outside of Mass. I would submit, however, that applying it to our participation in the liturgy itself represents a fundamental disorientation of our Christian identity. Participation in the sacred liturgy - and especially the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, the "source and summit" of our Christian life - should be a matter of the highest priority in terms of our time and energy.

    The ambitious programme put forward by @SponsaChristi (and which I remember very well from my days singing at an FSSP apostolate) is likely something that would be impossible outside of somewhere like a cathedral or a traditionalist personal parish. In particular, if people's availability to rehearse or to practice independently during the week is limited, the music might need to be simplified to fit the available rehearsal time. But the very idea that a parish's choir would object to having sung Masses every Sunday throughout the year and that the pastor of the parish would allow their objections to stand would have me shaking the dust from my feet and leaving.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • ServiamScores
    Posts: 3,390
    By the way, AnimaVocis reminded me of a recent lecture that I heard by Horst Bucholtz (former DoM in Detroit). He observed the fact that in America ,choirs sing every Sunday, but in Europe they spend weeks preparing for important holy days. He argued that it would be better to have choirs sing less often but better prepared when they do. I found this very intriguing.
  • Chant_Supremacist
    Posts: 370
    Choirs sing every Sunday at the European parishes I've been to.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • TCJ
    Posts: 1,072
    English and Spanish choirs sing pretty much year round, although the Spanish can cycle a bit so it's more like 3 out of every 4. No summer off. Youth choir sings up to 14 Masses a year, depending on ability.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,813
    Yeah and when they do take off it’s odd. St Mary’s in Sydney sings on the English model but takes Low Sunday off as a break. Understandable, but I’d take off the next two weeks instead and rotate among a small pool to ensure that the chant is offered. Ditto after Christmas.

    Episcopalians sing less somewhat per service compared to my parish, but we have less ambitious individual pieces. Their cathedral here preps six weeks ahead during the school year. Summers, two weeks.
  • ian_udell
    Posts: 31
    @probe

    Do they have rehearsal aids to practice at home? Is there a core of interested singers who want to sing any chance they get?


    They have plenty of rehearsal aids, and some to most of them know how to pluck out their part on piano, at least for the polyphony. And I would like to think most of them enjoy singing, but maybe they just prefer a choir that they don't have to practice outside of rehearsal?

    Is easier music the solution? Little to no polyphony?
  • PaxMelodious
    Posts: 511
    If I joined a parish choir I would expect to sing every Sunday, solemnity, Ash Wednesday, the Triduum, and anything else that comes up. I would also expect weekly rehearsals at the minimum as well as extra longer rehearsals during Lent and Advent.


    Agreed - and this is why I would not join a parish choir. (even with leaving out the part about practising at home).

    And if I'd joined what was billed as a special-occasion choir, and the director tried to change it into a regular parish choir, I'd be rather cross.

    Personally I'd be amenable to the arrangement laid out in the opening post - but only if it was done with consultation and agreement, not just music director's orders.

    But whether it's reasonable for the specific choir depends on the people involved, their relationship to the parish, and what other musical and personal commitments they have in their lives.
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,813
    It’s a dictatorship, not a democracy.

    Our schola only sang once a month. Then someone became more available, and so they went from one high Mass with full propers and Rossini the rest of the time to introit, offertory, and communion in full. After covid, the capable volunteer did all five propers because he simply had the power to do so.

    Like, yeah, it turns out that it’s a lot easier to do a good thing more often even with a few bumps along the way versus trying to do it once or twice a month. He’s not even singing every month at the same frequency! That’s hard to sustain and to justify to the parish as a whole.
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