Why is this "The greatest song ever"
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    Dowland's song "In Darkness Let me Dwell" has sometimes been called the greatest song ever written. I'm willing to go along with that. It is really amazing. The range, the drama, the unexpected harmonic turns, the complexity, the length of lines, the uncertain ending. Anyway, so it turns out that Youtube has a number of these online. Here are three versions: male alto, soprano, and baritone (Sting). I'm partial to the Sting version myself because it is less precious and more gritty. I just think he does an amazing job of it. Anyway, I wonder if you agree that this song is truly great, and I wonder if you know why, and, if so, do the lessons have broaden application.





  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637
    It's a wonderful song and one of the highlights of Renaissance secular music. The pathos is so deep. Jeffrey, I'll listen to Sting again if you listen to Mahler's 9th! Seriously, I appreciate his effort, but it only reminds me how good some of the early music singers are. BTW check out the viol consort version called the Lacrimae pavan. Exquisite.

    The other big hit of the day was Josquin's Mille regretz, which was known as the cancion del emperador, since Charles V loved it so much. No doubt that's why Morales set an imitation Mass on it.
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    You really don't like the Sting thing? Wow, maybe it's just me. But truly I must not listen to Mahler's 9th. I have too much to do before I pass from this earth. (Michael knows of my private superstition about this.)
  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637
    You know, I gave the Sting CD a good listen, and perhaps I heard too much Dowland sung in my day, but I find his renditions interesting, but in the end, not convincing. They are just ... different. I do applaud his foray into this music, but it ends up having the same effect as the Billy Joel piano CD: a brave effort, but obviously one that does not play to the artist's strengths. I would not, however, look down my nose at anyone that likes it. When one looks down their nose, they only show off the contents of their nose!
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    I guess I'm just a populist at heart ;)
  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637
    You are indeed popular!
  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637

    Jeffrey, Here's a little gift for you. Jordi Savall is acknowledged as the world's great viol player. Here's his group doing Dowland's setting of the tune for viol consort.



  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    Oh wow, magnificent.
  • mjcurtis
    Posts: 62
    how about "Spem in alium" by Tallis for 8 choirs and 40 parts. Tough to top it from a performing standpoint singing it.
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    i agree but it's not really a "song" right?
  • mjcurtis
    Posts: 62
    no it is not
  • Pes
    Posts: 623
    By the way, there's a setting of Victoria's O Magnum Mysterium for viol consort on this superb recording by Ensemble Chimera. Their other disc is wonderful, too, as are those by Sera Una Noche and Maria Ana Bobone.

    Part of the beauty of Dowland's song has to do with its combination of melancholy and formal discipline. Part, too, from how patiently it elapses. There is no sense of mechanism in it. It grows like a plant, or (if you like dolorous things), spreads like a stain.
  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637
    Since we are on the topic of sad songs. Here is Jordi Savall and boys once again, doing Josquin's Mille regretz. Carlos V must have been a morose guy!

  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    Oh! I think I recognize that!
  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637
    You're on your way to the wonderful world of Renaissance secular song! Next tune to learn is Fors seulement (many settings)
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    Seminar by Michael O'Connor! free!
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    Oh wait, I think Jeffrey O used a Mass setting based on this! yes, yes, that's how I know it. It was a Kyrie.

    Jeffrey?
  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637
    Here's a version by Obrecht. Yeah, we are getting far from liturgical music now...

  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    wow, those are some unusual instruments, and we are thankfully spared the "Krumhorn."

    On the issue of topic, I chose General Music for a reason. Presumably we are permitted to talk about anything in this section, even Mahler's 9th.
  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637
    Oh, crumhorns played well have a wonderful sound! This is a really fine period-instrument group that I did not know before this. Some of the playing is done by Piffaro, a group that started in Philadelphia, but is rather spread out now. Some of them traveled to Colombia with me to do a CD of music by colonial composers of the 16th century. Some nice stuff.
  • richardUKrichardUK
    Posts: 85
    Michael, you probably know it, but there is a wonderful Mass setting by Morales on Josquin's song Mille Regretz, for AATTBB, fabulous and dark-hued setting, really profound polyphony even for Morales, which I've done with a couple of groups over here. Mapa Mundi has a good edition
  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637
    Richard, oh yes, I have two recordings of it. The Chanticleer version is just a bit out of tune, though. Wonderful piece and probably written to curry favor with Charles V. Morales desperately wanted to be named his chapelmaster, but the emperor stuck with Flemish musicians, probably for political reasons.
  • Michael O'Connor
    Posts: 1,637
    BTW just heard a recording of the Tallis Scholars singing Ockeghem's (attrib.) Malheur me bat at the BBC Proms. The composition has been around for centuries, but no one has ever found the words. Peter Phillips had Jacques Darras, a modern French poet, write a poem after the first line.

    The translation is:

    Misfortune has struck me/battered me,
    My heart is sad.
    Joy has moved away,
    My birds have all taken flight.
    Sorrow lays me low.
    I am the tree in the night that will not see the morning light;
    That will not see the morning nor hear them sing in Latin.
    Misfortune has battered me,
    Sorrow lays me low.

    This is also a hauntingly beautiful 15th-c secular song, but I couldn't find a youtube clip. Equally stunning settings for the Mass are by Josquin and Obrecht
  • mlabelle
    Posts: 46
    I like Sting. I just feel badly for the muscles in his neck.
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