Litany of the Saints (again)
  • TLMlover
    Posts: 175
    Hi All,

    I read another forum thread about the Litany replacing the Universal Prayer on the solemnity of All Saints, and also about it being used as a processional. But can it be used as an offertory hymn on the solemnity of All Saints? Thanks in advance.
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,869
    That’s a bad idea.

    The Litany does invoke all holy ones and all of each category, but it is penitential and heart and is used on occasions which require penance and/or great solemnity (remember the Ember Days were the ordination days). It’s used in the Anglican tradition in some places for Lent evoking the stational Masses. But it’s not a good fit at all for either of those places; it has nothing like the structure of the universal prayer, and it’s not structurally sound for the offertory. There’s no rule, but it is unsound.
    Thanked by 2davido Chant_Supremacist
  • monasteryliturgistmonasteryliturgist
    Posts: 646
    I know that for Religious Professions the Litany does in fact replace the universal prayer, but I think that is a specific rubric for that mass. I have never heard of it replacing a litany in any other mass besides ordinations, professions, and consecration of virgins.
  • SponsaChristi
    Posts: 881
    I have never heard of it replacing a litany in any other mass besides ordinations, professions, and consecration of virgins.

    That’s because there are specific petitions and a special oration by the bishop that takes the place of the Universal Prayer. It’s like when there’s a baptism during Mass, there’s no Creed because the baptismal promises take its place.

    For example, these are the specific petitions added and sung and an added oration found in the Litany of the Saints in the non-updated poor translation of rite of the Consecration of a Virgin:

    Give to your servant Pope N.,
    and to all the other Bishops,
    the grace of growing daily in the
    likeness of Christ, Bridegroom of the Church,

    Maintain and foster in your Church love for holy virginity,

    Strengthen in Christ’s faithful people hope of a glorious resurrection and
    of the life of the world to come,

    Bring all peoples together in peace and true harmony,

    Increase in holiness and in number those who follow the counsels of the Gospel,

    Reward a hundredfold the parents of your handmaids for the sacrifice they have made,

    Bless these handmaids, make them holy, and consecrate them to your service, Jesus, Son of the living God

    Then the Bishop alone rises and, with hands joined, sings or says

    Lord,
    hear the prayers of your Church.
    Look with favor on your handmaids
    whom you have called in your love.
    Set them on the way of eternal salvation; may they seek only what is pleasing to you, and fulfill it with watchful care.
    Through Christ our Lord.
    All:
    Amen.

    https://diolc.org/files/consecratedlife/Complete Rite.pdf



    Not sure how many people in charge of organizing the music and ensuring the rubrics are correct for less frequently used rites, but I keep seeing rubrics not followed in online recordings. They mean something and should be followed even if they don’t make sense at the time or the petitions seem controversial or offensive to some.
  • CaleferinkCaleferink
    Posts: 473
    I wouldn't do it as an Offertory or really at all on All Saints Day. It has a specific liturgical purpose on the occasions when it is sung, and I think singing it outside of those times can make things a bit awkward for the reasons above and then some. Now, having said that, I'm actually using it on All Souls Day, with "ora(te) pro nobis" changed to "ora(te) pro eis" ("eis" being the fidelium defunctorum); we have a columbarium in the courtyard behind our church (also serves as an outdoor stations of the cross) to where we process at the end of Mass, so we sing the litany during the procession there.
    Thanked by 1Chant_Supremacist
  • TLMlover
    Posts: 175
    Great information everyone, thank you!

    It makes me sad that our parish never gets to sing the Litany of the Saints because we have no Easter Vigil here (too small), no professions nor consecrations, and no columbarium. But rules is rules.

    Thanks everyone, enjoy All Saints at your parishes!
  • monasteryliturgistmonasteryliturgist
    Posts: 646
    You can I believe replace it with the Divine Praises at benediction, if y'all do that where you are
  • SponsaChristi
    Posts: 881
    It makes me sad that our parish never gets to sing the Litany of the Saints because we have no Easter Vigil here (too small), no professions nor consecrations, and no columbarium.

    Baptisms? That’s where I always heard it growing up. You could also sing it privately outside of Mass. I find it very helpful keeping my car on the highway when driving in whiteout conditions.

    Our MD uses it during mass rather frequently during the Offertory and once during communion (during communion was a bit weird).
    Thanked by 1Chant_Supremacist
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,869
    Have processions from the old ritual and do it then.
    Thanked by 1SponsaChristi
  • TLMlover
    Posts: 175
    "Our MD uses it during mass rather frequently during the Offertory and once during communion (during communion was a bit weird)."

    Sponsa could you elaborate on your MD using the Litany during the Offertory?

    Matthew, I will suggest this to Father, thanks!
  • SponsaChristi
    Posts: 881
    Sponsa could you elaborate on your MD using the Litany during the Offertory?

    I’m not sure what’s to elaborate on. Sometimes instead of a song out of the OCP book, they’ll sing the Litany of the Saints until the incensing is complete.
  • RoborgelmeisterRoborgelmeister
    Posts: 439
    It makes me sad that our parish never gets to sing the Litany of the Saints

    What about the First Sunday in Lent?
    Thanked by 1Caleferink
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