Spanish-English pew card or PDF?
  • Earl_GreyEarl_Grey
    Posts: 890
    Is anyone aware of a side-by-side Spanish-English Order of Mass (text only) that would contain all of the common texts of the Mass/responses? This is for a one-time event in a Catholic School.

    I produced a custom one for our community and went through the process of securing copyright permissions, but I'm not able to share it. Certainly there must be something commercially available besides a full-blown missalette or book. A reproducible PDF for one-time use would be ideal. Even a pack of pew cards would work.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,157
    A pew card with the Order of Mass usually takes two sides of a card just for one language, so you may have to look for separate English and Spanish products.
  • Earl_GreyEarl_Grey
    Posts: 890
    I haven't found anything available commercially. I'd be happy to share the one I made. It's a 10 page booklet without the full text of the Eucharistic prayers and if one were to cut all the options it could be condensed further. For me it was part of a larger project, but due to copyright restrictions I can't make it available. So much for active participation and inculturation. I'll suggest to the priest to just say the Mass in Latin.
  • irishtenoririshtenor
    Posts: 1,295
    I have also made one for seminary use, @Earl_Grey, but there’s no way I could keep it readable and also on one page
  • Earl_GreyEarl_Grey
    Posts: 890
    The issue isn't how many pages, just the copyright permission. A former student asked me for the file, but I can't share it because of copyright. That's when I started looking for some type of pew card (obviously not one page), that would be free to use/copy, but can't find anything.

    The same thing happens when trying to pray the office. We can't expect people or a parish to buy books and missalettes for a one time event, so we need to print a special program. Even if copyright permission is granted for such an event, there is no resource available to copy and past the official Mass or Office texts into such a program. One has to create it from scratch. It just doesn't make sense.

    Even those of us who subscribe to One License, there isn't an available download for all text and music items. For example, GIA only offers graphics from the most recent hymnals. If one wanted to use a hymn as it appears in Worship III or Worship II (heaven forbid), the license may cover the usage, but one would have to scan it from a book or create something new from scratch.

    I understand why the official texts of the Church need to be copy protected, but they could also be made more readily available on a website with a Creative Commons license or similar permission for non-profit liturgical use. How many of us have to create a custom resource from scratch? If we could share such efforts, we would then have more time for rehearsals and prayer!
  • irishtenoririshtenor
    Posts: 1,295
    That would definitely be good. I got better and more efficient at it the more I did it, but I have spent a lot of time typing English translations of Spanish collects, among other things!
  • bhcordovabhcordova
    Posts: 1,152
    The USCCB is quite happy to let you use the electronic version for a fee. There are quite a few conditions on it as well, but as long as you pay the hefty fee....
  • mattebery
    Posts: 14
    I think the USCCB doesn't charge for one-time use
  • Schönbergian
    Posts: 1,063
    For one, I don't understand why the official texts of the Church need to be copy protected. We've done just fine having most of the Tridentine Mass in PD at least without any schmuck causing serious damage to it. I don't see how it would suddenly happen with the English texts if they were made PD.
    Thanked by 1a_f_hawkins
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,157
    The Mass ordinary texts belong to ICEL rather than USCCB. ICEL doesn't charge parishes for one-time-use printing, but might want to charge for a longer-lasting pew card. Maybe.
  • a_f_hawkins
    Posts: 3,371
    The Church of England is less officious ;-
    2 A service or combination of services from the publications listed in condition (d) below, or extracts from them, may be reproduced for its own use by a parish, team or group ministry, cathedral or institution without application to the Archbishops’ Council for copyright permission and without payment of a fee, provided the following conditions are complied with:
    (a)The copies are not to be sold.
    (b)The name of the parish, team or group ministry, cathedral or institution is to be shown on the front cover (or first page, if there is no cover). In the case of a single occasionuse, the date of the service must also be included.
    (c)In the case of reproduction for repeated use the number of copies made from the same original is not to exceed 500.
    (d)The following copyright acknowledgement is to be included (include only the relevant title or titles): ....
    Thanked by 1Earl_Grey
  • Earl_GreyEarl_Grey
    Posts: 890
    ICEL owns the English texts of the Mass, but the USCCB owns the recent Spanish translation for use in the U.S.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,157
    Here's ICEL's permissions policy: http://icelweb.org/copyright.htm

    USCCB seems to have adopted a generous permissions policy for its Spanish missal. If I'm reading the notice at the bottom of the page correctly, it's OK to reproduce the text for non-commercial use in publications that are not intended for sale.
    http://usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/la-santa-misa/musica-para-el-misal-romano.cfm
  • GerardH
    Posts: 411
    Here's ICEL's permissions policy: http://icelweb.org/copyright.htm

    This seems not to account for all cases. Publications produced for sale are subject to royalties; publications for single use and not sold are royalty free; but what of publications for permanent use which are not sold? Most pewcards definitely fall in this last category.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,157
    There is a longer permissions document on the site (linked from that page), which might answer that question. Or perhaps one might have to contact ICEL in Washington to ask.
    Thanked by 1GerardH
  • GerardH
    Posts: 411
    Well spotted Chonak. Here is the relevant section from that document:

    Publications for More than One-Time Use

    No royalty is charged on publications for more than one-time use such as hymnals and other participation aids containing ICEL texts and produced by parishes, schools, or religious communities for their individual use and not by an outside firm, provided that the group printing this publication does not sell it. Permission must be obtained from ICEL for the inclusion of ICEL texts in publications for more than one-time use.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,157
    So it seems no royalty is charged, but permission must be obtained? That should be helpful for parishes. Thanks for checking.
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