Looking for Solesmes restituted Invitatory mode VI.a for ferial office
  • XpfXpf
    Posts: 4
    I am looking for a Solesmes restitution of the Venite Exultemus invitatory psalm called mode VI.a both in Jandel Antiphonary and Nocturnale Romanum. It starts with Sol - Si bemol exactly like for the Office of the Dead of the Liber Usualis. This latter is good for me as it contains all the rythmic signs but it lacks the "Gloria Patri" at the end of course. The mode 6 in the Liber Hymnarius of 1983 is close to it but the tenor is on La instead of Si bemol which is strange as I usually found Si bemol in old breviaries and also in the Worcester manuscript. The Antiphonarium Romanum of 1760 says it is the mode for the ferial office and the Nocturnale score refers to PT 371v but I don't know what PT is (Proprium of Tempore?, manuscript?,...) as I did not find PT in the Nocturnale abbreviation catalogue. I can easily build the missing "Gloria Patri" in a Solesmes way with rythmic signs but I would prefer an official restitution from Solesmes if it has existed. Many thanks for any help.
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  • Simon
    Posts: 153
    Couldn't find exactly what you are looking for but I have a choir book published in 1904 for Cistercian use that has the Invitatory psalm in several modes including a VI with start Sol - Si bemol. Maybe it can be helpful if you need to build your own Gloria Patri. imageimageimage
    IMG_20190312_150230.jpg
    2336 x 4160 - 3M
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    2336 x 4160 - 3M
    IMG_20190312_150137.jpg
    4160 x 2336 - 3M
    Thanked by 2Paul F. Ford CHGiffen
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,704
    Have you tried the Tilburg Nocturnale, (Liber Nocturnalis)
    See this thread https://forum.musicasacra.com/forum/discussion/7931/matins/p2
    direct link that will hopefully work here,
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/f6v7ms0356l1oax/Nocturnale_Tilburg.pdf?dl=0

    OR here,
    https://gregobase.selapa.net/source.php?id=23&images=1&index=1
    Thanked by 1Simon
  • Simon
    Posts: 153
    tomjaw: The examples you give all have the VI mode examples with the tenor on the La.

    Xpf is looking for examples that start with Sol - Si bemol with the tenor on the Si bemol - and then preferably from a Solesmes publication. I couldn't find one. Only the Cistercian publication.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • VilyanorVilyanor
    Posts: 388
    I could be wrong on this, but I believe the Liber Hymnarius represents the "authentic" melody for that mode. Remember that the modal system is an instrumental system, it doesn't always reflect the idiosyncrasies of individual chants, and chants don't always perfectly reflect the modal theories, especially in the psalm tones of various kinds. I would stick with the Liber Hymnarius.
    Thanked by 1Simon
  • a_f_hawkins
    Posts: 3,371
    As Xpf says this tone appears at the Office for the Dead, and has no Doxology. All the recent (Solesmes and later) sources I have found use that tonal flavour for no other purpose.
  • GerardH
    Posts: 411
    There's a Sarum tone starting at the bottom of page 57 on this document which is clearly related to the one you're looking for. Again, not a Solesmes restitution and without rhythmic signs, but it does have the Gloria Patri.

    EDIT: @Simon, having followed up tomjaw's links, I think you were mistaken in your correction. The Tillburg Nocturnale available at the Dropbox link does indeed have a Mode VI tone with the tenor on Si bemol (page numbered 20 / p.24 of the pdf). In fact it matches the Liber Usualis tone exactly - and it has the Gloria Patri. @Xpf, that may be the closest you'll get.
    Thanked by 2tomjaw Simon
  • XpfXpf
    Posts: 4
    Many thanks to all of you, it really helps. It is the first time I have posted a message on this forum and I am impressed by the feedback.

    Indeed, it is strange that the Liber Hymnarius replaced this traditional tone even for the office of the Dead with "Regem cui omnia vivunt" anthem by their Mode VI tone with a La tenor despite all sources which tend to prefer the Si bemol tenor.

    Perhaps the tone I am looking for with a Solesmes stamp can be found in books that Solesmes published at Desclée for other Orders - I have checked in the Cantuale Romano-Seraphicum and the Proprium Carmelitarum but without success. There may be other Solesmes books published for these Orders or for others which may contain it...
    Thanked by 1Simon
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