Messiaen's 100th
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    I know that I should post something liturgical to celebrate Messianen's 100th birthday anniversary tomorrow but I can't help but put this up. It is smashing and astonishing!

  • Dave
    Posts: 64
    That's my favorite movement from Turangalila-symphonie.

    (You could have posted his "O sacrum convivium." :) )
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    done! and the contrast nicely illustrates the point that some things belong at liturgy and some things do not

  • Daniel Bennett PageDaniel Bennett Page
    Posts: 833
    When I was in Cleveland I did a short series of lectures (Music en route to the Holy) on explicity Christian/Catholic music programmed by the Cleveland Orchestra one season.
  • Pes
    Posts: 623
    Isn't that Turangalila movement great? It cheers me up every time I hear it. The best, recklessly jOYoUs music one can currently imagine!

    AND THOSE ARE KIDS!

    /relatively, I realize

    Note too how terrific the cinematography is. It's as lively as the music.

    MESSAIEN ROCKS! BEAT THIS, YOU ARID SECULARS AND SECULAR WANNABES!
  • priorstf
    Posts: 460
    Sadly, unlike some of the mighty around here, I find myself extraordinarily un-fond of Messaien's work. Yet another reason to appreciate Chant, perhaps.
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    priorstf, not liking Messiaen is the first step to a life-long love!
  • soli
    Posts: 95
    I played one of Messiaen's Vingt Regards Sur L'Enfant Jesus - "La premiere communion de la Vierge" (the Incarnation) - for piano- and found it very moving. I never took time to explore his orchestral works, but heard one of his organ pieces before. I think his music is mysterious and interesting.
  • RagueneauRagueneau
    Posts: 2,592
    priorstf, I am with you
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    priorstf, I'm with you. Messiaen gets on my nerves. Let the mighty have him. I would rather listen to and play Franck and Vierne any day.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    I'm on the pro-Messiaen side, although from a perspective of ignorance. I can't wait to learn more about him and his music! (that is, after all, what I'm back in college for!)
  • kevinfkevinf
    Posts: 1,184
    Langlais once said to a group of us that Messiaen was an acquired taste. He smiled as he said that. I often wondered what he met. I personally love it, but the one I really love is Tournemire. Tournemire is the chant composer par excellence.

    I was fortunate to hear Messiaen at Trinite one Sunday. It was wonderful. He played one of the movements of the L'Ascension suite.
  • Mark M.Mark M.
    Posts: 632
    Well, lo and behold! Look at today's featured article on the English Wikipedia. (Prescient you are, Jeffrey!)
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    I meant to do that.
  • G
    Posts: 1,397
    [blockquote]Sadly, unlike some of the mighty around here, I find myself extraordinarily un-fond of Messaien's work. [/blockquote]
    I had always found that I could admire it, without actually liking it (kind of like oh-so-healthy vegetables, like spinach...;o))
    But a recital at St John Cantius a few weeks ago and the program notes written by the organist, Br Jonathan, (y'all know him, he was at the Colloquium, and chanted on of the prophecies or lessons at one of the Masses, beautifully,) changed all that -- he said to listen to it the way you look at some paintings, from a distance, not too closely or carefully, so that the details blur, (my word, not his,) and the sonorities wash over you.
    Put a Messiaen CD on in the background while you do something else, (the Office reading, perhaps?) and you might find him a very different experience.

    [blockquote]I personally love it, but the one I really love is Tournemire. [/blockquote]
    You have that in common with Gavin, IIRC from his posts on TNLM.

    (Save the Liturgy, Save the World)
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    Guilty as charged! Tournemire is incredible. If I wind up at an EF church, I'm just going to perpetually use L'Orgue Mystique for the Mass. First I need a copy of it. It happens to be on IMSLP, but is BLOCKED due to copyright!! I would actually pay a lot for it, I just don't know who to give my money to!
  • priorstf
    Posts: 460
    Jeffrey Tucker saith: not liking Messiaen is the first step to a life-long love!

    My mother used to say something similar when she served liver. No dice. Many, many years later and I'm quite certain it is a taste I'll never acquire, let alone love.

    On a somewhat more serious side related to this group, I had the disturbing realization that my response to Messiaen may not be wholly unlike the response some people have to Chant. You can tell me how beautiful it is all day but it doesn't pass my test. Even the liturgical selection you posted would send me packing. Sorry about that, but it gives me pause.
  • incantuincantu
    Posts: 989
    Am I the only one who hears nothing but "Deep in the Heart of Texas"?
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    ok, because today is the day, here is a great one! Heard at the colloquium in 08! (A visitor turned to me with alarm and said: "Whatever happened to Bach?!")

    L'Ascension

  • kevinfkevinf
    Posts: 1,184
    Just wonderful. One of my favorites to play.

    Two or three years ago, we had Paul Jacobs play the entire body of Messiaen's organ music in one afternoon in Atlanta. I made it for about 4 of the 6 hours. Talk about immersion. But you really get a sense of his compositional development. Paul Jacobs was just incredible. Good Catholic boy that he is.

    Gavin, it took me 15 years to buy all of L'Orgue Mystique. Is not cheap. Contact me backchannel as I have the annotations of all the chants used by Tournemire, some of which are not propers of the day, particularly, the Piece Terminale.
  • tdunbar
    Posts: 120
    imagine a DVD of La transfiguration de Notre-Seigneur Jésus-Christ, with CGI enhancement of performance :)
  • tdunbar
    Posts: 120
    "Rumor has it that Bob Dylan, Don Knuth and Mel Gibson have contracted with Pixar and Peter Jackson to produce an animation of Messaien's Transfiguration" :)
  • BruceL
    Posts: 1,072
    I think a lot of reason some may be unconvinced about the genius of Messiaen's organ music is because it depends heavily (to me, at least) on "environmental factors". You really need a good-to-great acoustic to help give it a nice "halo" of sound (witness: nothing more painful than "L'apparition de l'Eglise eternelle" in a dry room) as well as a decent organ with the necessary beauty of tone and color stops to make things work. In addition, you have to "live with the music" a lot. Even after the correct notes and rhythms are there, there is so much to just get under your skin before it is a convincing performance. Program notes are a must, whether it's in a church setting or concert. I think with those ingredients, it's tough not to use it. If one or all of those is missing, though, it's a disaster.
  • Jan
    Posts: 242
    I agree with Bruce.
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