Tallis' The Third Tune: "Why fum'th in sight"
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 2,858
    I just printed two versions of Tallis' "Third Tune" with the text "Why fum'th is sight..." (from CPDL). Bothe containe the first verse only. Does anyone have the other verses? (I've heard performances with four verses.)
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,412
    Bothe containe the first verse only


    Bothe containe thee firft verfe onlie.


    *fixed
  • SalieriSalieri
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    Believe it or not, I tend to adde E-s to the ends of wordes without thinking, much to the consternation of not a few people...
    Thanked by 1Adam Wood
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
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    sorry- it was just too funny in context
  • SalieriSalieri
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    Yf onlye I hadde done itt purpofefullie!
    Thanked by 1Gavin
  • MHIMHI
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  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 2,858
    Found it!

    1. Why fumeth in sight: the Gentils spite,
    In fury raging stout?
    Why taketh in hond: the people fond,
    Uayne thinges to bring about?

    2. The kinges arise: the lordes deuise,
    in counsayles mett therto:
    Agaynst the Lord: with false accord,
    against his Christ they go.

    3. Let vs they say: breake downe their ray,
    of all their bondes and cordes:
    We will renounce: that they pronounce,
    their loores as stately lordes.

    4. But God of might: in heauen so bright,
    Shall laugh them all to scorne:
    The Lord on hie: shall them defie,
    they shall be once forlorne.

    5. Then shall his ire: speake all in fire,
    to them agayne therfore:
    He shall with threate: their malice beate,
    in his displeasure sore.

    6. Yet am I set: a king so great,
    on Sion hill full fast:
    Though me they kill: yet will that hill,
    my lawe and worde outcast.

    7. Gods wordes decreed: I (Christ) wil sprede
    for God thus sayd to me/e:
    My sonne I say: thou art, this day,
    I haue begotten the/e.

    8. Aske thou of me/e: I will geue the/e,
    to rule all Gentils londes:
    Thou shalt possesse: in suernesse,
    the world how wide it stondes.

    9. With iron rod: as mighty God,
    all rebels shalt thou bruse:
    And breake them all: in pieces small,
    as sherdes the potters vse.

    10. Be wise therfore: ye kinges the more,
    Receyue ye wisdomes lore:
    Ye iudges strong: of right and wrong,
    aduise you now before.

    11. The Lorde in feare: your seruice beare,
    with dread to him reioyce:
    Let rages be: resist not ye,
    him serue with ioyfull voyce.

    12. The sonne kisse ye: lest wroth he be,
    lose not the way of rest:
    For when his ire: is set on fire,
    who trust in hym be blest.

    Thanked by 1Chrism
  • MHIMHI
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  • Chrism
    Posts: 824
    Looks like sight to me in what purports to be the original:

    image
    1173 x 307 - 114K
  • MHIMHI
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  • Chrism
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    Interestingly, the word is spelled differently in each part.
  • MHIMHI
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    Thanked by 1noel jones, aago
  • SalieriSalieri
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    I new it'd only be a matter of time 'til someone posted something in iambic pentameter!
  • MHIMHI
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    Thanked by 1Adam Wood
  • MHIMHI
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  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,412
    The time has come, Archbishop said,
    to sing of my many things
    of shoes and ships and sealing wax
    and God, our Sovereign King.
    And why a Psalter ought to rhyme,
    and whether Words have Wings.
    Thanked by 3CHGiffen Chrism MHI
  • The often very low literary quality of a lot of these metrical psalms makes one realize why the hymns of Charles Wesley (and, somewhat, Dr. Watts) so revolutionized sung religious poetry in English.
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen Salieri
  • MHIMHI
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  • MHIMHI
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    Thanked by 1chonak
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 2,858
    Does anyone know of a text that would fit this tune, or would want to write one? Something suitable for Tempus per annum. Its a lovely piece, a shame to just let it languish.
  • SpikeD
    Posts: 1
    There's John Mason's How Shall I Sing that Majesty.

    This video has a choir sing the first stanza:

    How shall I sing that Majesty
    Which angels do admire?
    Let dust in dust and silence lie;
    Sing, sing, ye heavenly choir.
    Thousands of thousands stand around
    Thy throne, O God most high;
    Ten thousand times ten thousand sound
    Thy praise; but who am I?
    Thanked by 1Chrism
  • Chrism
    Posts: 824
    "I heard the voice of Jesus say" was traditionally set to the Third Tune, although some might consider it an offense against religion to swap out Kingsfold.

    Here are some others, from Hymnary.org, which has a useful search engine for this purpose.
  • MHIMHI
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  • MHIMHI
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  • I am no scholar but, for what it is worth, the word ´fight´ seems appropriate for ´fremuerunt´, since one of the meanings of fremere' is ´to roar´. It is only speculation on my part, but a printer setting type from a handwritten document, unaware of the context, might have mistaken an ´f´ for the long ´s´, which was still in use in English at the time of Thomas Tallis. In Latin, ´quare fremuerunt gentes´ is, of course, third person plural, whilst the English -´(e)th´ inflexion is more commonly thought of as third person singular. It could also be plural. At an earlier stage of English, the inflexion -´(e)th (´ð´/´þ´ - the difference in pronunciation is, broadly, the difference between ´thin and ´the´, although it varied with position) was a third person singular or an all plural inflexion.

    Moreover, alliteration in the first verse, with ´fight´ adds weight to its use, I think:

    Fumeth/Fight/Fury

    takeTH/THe/THings
  • MHIMHI
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    Thanked by 1Adam Wood
  • SalieriSalieri
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    MHI, thanks so much! Do you know the name of the book that the original came from, I'd be interested to look it up.
    Thanked by 1MHI
  • MHIMHI
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    Thanked by 2CHGiffen Salieri
  • MHIMHI
    Posts: 324
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