That moment when your music ministry is praised for being "traditional"
  • FidemInFidebusFidemInFidebus
    Posts: 611
    Just a happy little story from this morning's service. We had a guest pastor who works at a local homeless shelter, older gentleman probably in his mid 70's. During the summer we do a "hymn sing" at the beginning of the service where anyone can pick their favorite and we sing it. We usually choose three hymns for that, then we do two others for the regular service. They usually pick the good old tunes, this morning they chose In the Garden, He Lives, and another one I can't recall. The pastor was moved by the fact that we still appreciate and sing the old hymns and spent a few impromptu minutes talking about the state of church music today. While we do some contemporary stuff too, the majority of the music we do is traditional, and it's one reason I do love working there. Anyway, gave me a reason to smile today.
    Thanked by 3CHGiffen canadash CharlesW
  • ClergetKubiszClergetKubisz
    Posts: 1,912
    That's great to hear! I think all too often, we encounter people, especially clergy who have this knee-jerk aversion to anything traditional.

    This has happened to me, too, but only when we have guest priests, usually from another country. We had an African priest who asked me why we don't use our organ (he played the organ, too), and I told him that our pastor had asked me not to use it. He responded with, "Why not? It's beautiful," praising the instrument. With the school children, we used to get compliments all the time from parishioners, thanking us for using Latin, and for singing chant. However, the clergy wasn't as interested in it.
  • ronkrisman
    Posts: 1,394
    GARDEN and ACKLEY, the two tunes identified by the OP, are hardly "traditional" hymn tunes. Both are categorized as "Gospel songs," and both are fairly dismal examples of that musical genre, IMO. I don't have a "knee-jerk aversion to anything traditional," nor even a knee-jerk aversion to all Gospel songs. IN THE GARDEN and ACKLEY don't cause my knee to jerk; it's more a case of their causing a pain in my neck. Or heartburn.

    @CK, can you hum either of these tunes, whose description as "traditional" by the guest pastor in the OP's posting you appear to accept unquestioningly?
    Thanked by 1M. Jackson Osborn
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 2,315
    Considering that the OP works at a Protestant church, I suspect that Gospel tunes might be, nowadays, considered traditional, though this was hardly the case in mainline churches until recent years.

    It also was just one musician reflecting upon the similar (similar enough in this profession) experiences of him or herself to those of another. Take it as it is, Father, and nothing more. (It certainly doesn’t require commentary on the intensity of your reactions to traditional music.)
    Thanked by 3ClergetKubisz Spriggo Scott_W
  • ClergetKubiszClergetKubisz
    Posts: 1,912
    Can you hum either of these tunes, whose description as "traditional" by the guest pastor in the OP's posting you appear to accept unquestioningly?


    I don't appreciate the tone of the pointed question. I didn't express any kind of approval or disapproval of the content indicated, just that I was supportive of the compliment that she received, and related an anecdote of my own.

    @MatthewRoth: thank you for defending me.
    Thanked by 1Scott_W
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 2,315
    (I think Fidem is a she.)
    Thanked by 2ClergetKubisz Ben
  • Scott_WScott_W
    Posts: 468
    ronkrisman, I'm obliged to think the best I can of others, so I'm going to chalk your comment up to merely having a bad day within reach of a keyboard.
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    Scott,

    I can't agree that Fr. Krisman appears to be having a bad day. He merely rejected the characterization of two "songs" as traditional. When Catholic catalogs call Here I am, Lord, Amazing Grace,How Great Thou Art, and On Eagle's Wings Traditional Catholic music.... the label appears to be utterly meaningless. Fr. Krisman is merely challenging the worthlessization of a word.
    Thanked by 1M. Jackson Osborn
  • Andrew_Malton
    Posts: 1,187
    worthlessization sheesh there's no need to go inventing words, English has a perfectly good word floccinaucinihilipilification, for that.
    Thanked by 3CHGiffen Casavant Organist M. Jackson Osborn
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,980
    Someone slept late and missed the medication cart this morning. Get out the happy pills. LOL.
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen Casavant Organist
  • FidemInFidebusFidemInFidebus
    Posts: 611
    Geez this was supposed to be a HAPPY post! LOL! And yes, those hymns are traditional now in the Presbyterian church I suppose (which is where I currently work)... And yes, I am a she. Lololol
    Thanked by 5CHGiffen Andrew_Malton CharlesW Casavant Organist PaxMelodious
  • StimsonInRehabStimsonInRehab
    Posts: 1,933
    Charles, you managed to describe my work situation of the past three years in one post.
    Thanked by 1CharlesW
  • FidemInFidebusFidemInFidebus
    Posts: 611
    @Chris: Eagles Wings and Here I Am, Lord are in another contemporary hymnal we use from time to time. It is rumored that a previous accompanist quit over the church's decision to start using this hymnal. We mainly use the good old red and a dark blue Presbyterian hymnal (honestly we should use the latter more often, good stuff in there.) Anyway, I state again that I DO NOT work in a Catholic Church, and no one here is suggesting the above mentioned SONGS are considered traditional. They're considered contemporary even where I work.
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    Fidem,

    Ok. I think I knew you weren't working in a Catholic parish. My point in addressing the post the way I did was to defend Fr. Krisman (with whom I frequently disagree) and to insist on the intelligible use of words. Since I apparently misunderstood that someone had claimed two song to be traditional (two songs, by the way, that I don't know), I'm sorry to have been addressing a claim you didn't make.

  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,980
    Was this the "He Lives" you played? I remember playing this when I worked for the Baptists 40+ years ago. Everybody knows the "Gardening Song" as we used to call it. LOL.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bc1CBrtpkok
  • FidemInFidebusFidemInFidebus
    Posts: 611
    Yes that's the one.
  • JesJes
    Posts: 576
    Plenty of the youth and not so youthful have stated that 70's hymns are "traditional" of late down my end of the equator in a nearby parish. My knees jerked so badly my knees decided to automatically give way at the kneelers at church to pray that these people get a new priest. It happened and they got probably the most traddy priest they could get. Now they actually sing the Gloria where it is supposed to be instead of a hymn with words that were a weird rough translation guesstimate of the Gloria!
  • ClergetKubiszClergetKubisz
    Posts: 1,912
    Yes, that's generally the definition of "traditional" in my area as well, although YMMV, as usual. I used to chuckle to myself when our pastor would tell the acoustician when we were building our new church that we had "traditional music;" he wouldn't allow chant, Latin, nor use of the organ!
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,415
    'Traditional.'

    This is sick. It displays, doesn't it?, what a cruel temporal cocoon people are living in today. The cream of my life was lived in the mid-to-late XXth century, but from my youth up until now it was self-evident to me (and I should think, most of my peers) that something had to be at least (at least!) two-hundred years old to merit being called 'traditional'. How can anything that is only ten, thirty, or fifty years old be sanely referred to as 'traditional'. Why, it hasn't even any roots. This is sick. It displays an utter ignorance of history, values, worth, and cultural identity. That people can call such recent things 'traditional' without the immediate eruption of uncontrollable laughter from any and all within earshot is astounding. There is no laughter, of course, because something just tells these hearers that the person is not, as one might rightly assume, joking, but is quite serious - and culturally sick, the piteous inhabitant of a very small temporal cocoon.

    It is contemptable that such small minded and ill-educated men and women are set over us as pastors, even bishops, teachers and even musicians.
    Thanked by 2ClergetKubisz Elmar
  • FidemInFidebusFidemInFidebus
    Posts: 611
    Admin, kindly remove this thread. And remind me never to share anything remotely happy on this board ever again. Not purple. Serious. *eyeroll*
  • JesJes
    Posts: 576
    ... And my mind went here the moment happy was mentioned.
    https://youtu.be/uTEjV276078

    But seriously, you did well to get a compliment about traditional hymns. I must say I reckon most are feeling that same breathe of relief to hear that.
    I know I see priest friends let their hair down when I say "don't worry, I'm doing real hymns" I remember being appointed in the ordinariate parish (which are lucky enough to do lots of crazy traddy Methodist hymns.) and I remember turning around the priest with a "silly" list that contained the following.

    Organ prelude: pachelbels canon
    Introit: shine Jesus shine
    Offertory: on eagles wings
    Organ offertory: 12 tone row on the tune of our father
    Communion: take and eat
    Communion: Bach toccata and fugue in D minor...
    Recessional: go out my sisters and sing the good news.
    Postlude: theme and variations Mary had a little Lamb.


    The real hymns were actually awesome but I remember looking at the heart attack brewing in his facial veins. Hehe.
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,415
    jesearle -
    You are in an ordinariate parish?
    Which parish?
    Which ordinariate?
    You are in Australia?

    I see that you have quite a sense of humour!
    No doubt your dodecaphonous treatment of the Our Father was a highlight of the mass!
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,216
    [Dear Nitpickers: don't. Thank you. --admin]
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