Would you approve of Publisher?

You know how some people don't seem to even notice that one song or another is appropriate for church? I don't mean people who specifically like bad music, but people who literally can't see anything majorly different between Adoro Te Devote and Gather Us In.

You know how there are people who truly cannot tell the difference between a real pipe organ and a digital simulacrum, and don't understand why in the world you bother spending all that money when the digital is just as good?

You know how there are people who listen to an out of tune piano and don't realize why it's bad? Or who don't see anything different AT ALL between croony belting and legit choral singing?

How you all feel when people say crap like that is how I feel when people think that print design (and web design) is basically something anyone can do and use whatever tools because, you know, I basically know what looks good and anyway no one really notices fonts.

Use good tools. Use good fonts. Reset music so it matches. Design things well. Don't put up with mismatched margins or off-centered images. Learn the difference between a jpg and a png. Print things on decent paper. Fold them squarely.

Times New Roman is Finale's default along with many other programs, but that doesn't make it a good choice, especially for music and bulletins and worship aids. It's a font intended for newspaper/tabloid publishing, not good for long documents, books (especially novels or poetry), or correspondence. It's far too narrow, suitable for a tabloid or newspaper maybe.

We've had this discussion here previously. People have their own favorites, but NYT is not one of them, by a long shot. All of my own templates for Finale have been (re)written for Palatino Linotype fonts, which is MUCH better, although I've also used various incarnations of Garamond with success. My biggest complaint about word processers, engraving programs, etc. is that, by and large, although it's possible to change fonts to something desirable, it is usually not possible to specify a default font family for startup (hence, for Finale, the necessity of tweaking all the templates and writing new ones).

MS WORD??!!!!!!! Not you too, Steve!

Just like the music, which lingers in the air for oh so brief a moment.

Yes... this is why the simulicrum is acceptable also: 'O, whatever gets the job done. Don't spend any more time or money or effort at it than is needed'. PHOEY. YOU PHONIES! Get your stuff together. You can't stand for quality in one area and not another. There is a term for that: hypocrisy.

Actually, come to think of it after reading some other comments, I prefer Times New Roman precisely for the reason others don't. It takes less space per word or syllable. When visually scanning the page in reading either text or music, its the spacing between that's more important. A nicer font that takes even 10% more space will cause me to have fewer notes/syllables per line of music.

simulicrum

?

Sounds like synthetic mothers' milk maybe.

The prissy and eternally fussy shall inherit the earth - they deserve it. LOL. Function determines form when it comes to handouts. If it is for a major event, more time and effort goes into it. If it is for one time use then thrown into the floor, not so much.

Just because you CAN overdo things doesn't mean you should. LOL.

God is perfectly capable of taking care of himself, a fact far too many forget. LOL.

sorry sergeant. i am done and if the admin wishes to split this off that's fine. i just can't stand for those who make excuses for mediocrity when it comes to the liturgy... if its for your house, then fine, but not for God's house.

Whether it's music or programs or whatever, we simply do the best we can in the time we have and with the resources available. But there is a hierarchy. If I have to choose how I spend my time, the music wins because it is an integral part of the liturgy while a paper program is not. If I really have to decide whether to spend time developing organ improvisation skills or developing graphic design skills, organ wins. Call it excuses if you will, Francis, but responsible decisions have to be made, and at some point I have to go home to my family.

I have picked up enough of a minimum in the way of desktop publishing to make a program that is consistent and is simple to follow (or so people tell me), and when possible, reasonably attractive. That's enough for me. I happen to use Pages (the old version) because it was the best thing on the Mac I I herited. If I had a PC I would probably be making do with Word. With my limited budget, I refuse to spend a dime on publishing software.

To Adam's story about the Boston graphic designer: there are plenty of churches that spend waaaay to much on graphic design with little substance underneath. I'm sure (at least I hope) this person's decision whether or not to stay in the church was based more on what she encountered in the following weeks when she started going.

francis, with you and with myself, reactions to your/my polemics are fueled less by the content of what you champion, and more with the vehement (regarded as punitive) rhetoric you deploy. Shotgun expletives such as "you functionaries" without specifity within this forum are meant, by you, to condemn "some" of us. But you can get a pass because the impersonal pronoun doesn't self-condemn your own words and behavior. No one here of whom I'm aware, supports true mediocrity, and you know this.
I get Adam's contentions. I get Jackson's certainty. I get your passion.
But can we all please get some perspective before we explode this tempest outside our teapot?

Also, this:

Graphics people are not looking at programs through the eyes of congregations.

I object to this, on the grounds that congregations include graphics people, along with all other sorts of people.

My wife was recently at a liturgy where the programs were folded not-square. She mumbled something and fixed it. Someone else said, "Don't worry, no one will notice."

My wife noticed. Is she "no one"?

I would have noticed. Am I "no one"?


You know what I wouldn't notice? Whether the organ was voiced correctly. I have no idea what this means or why it matters. So, you know - you probably shouldn't do it. No one would notice. And it costs too much, there's other things to spend money and time on.

Also, correct registration of French organ literature. I would never notice this. I'm pretty sure no one else would either.

Or parallel fifths in your SATB harmonizations. I'd probably notice if I was asked to look for them. But I'd never notice by ear. And I think most people don't even know what that is.

And no one really notices when you mispronounce names in the Bible. Well, I notice. Sometimes. But I'm no one.

That stack of dusty hymnals in the corner of your loft? The crumpled up trash in the pew hymnal racks? The fishing line that once held a banner but now is just sort of sitting there dangling on the wall for no apparent reason? The ever-so-slight feedback in the sound system? The buzz when you dim the lights? The crooked candle on the left side of the altar? The one patch of paint that doesn't match the rest? The red plastic lighter left sitting next to the Advent wreath all through Mass?

No one notices any of this stuff. Best not to spend time on it.

You know, as someone totally inept at programs, yet using them more and more, I would find a session at the Colloquium on this subject to be very useful. I just use what I've randomly learned. Knowing more would certainly save me time and I would love to put out a professional looking program.

Moi aussi, except LITURGICAL DANCE.

Just off the cuff:

A music program should be transparent. In other words, it should become "invisible" in its own right and focus all attention on the act of worship. Use one font, keep it readable, stay away from graphics (clip art, etc), and keep it very clean and enough white space so it's not crowded. Use an off white paper stock, or something with a subtle texture. Don't use white office copy paper. There is nothing wrong with Times. It is a classic font. But look at garamond, or even weiss.

Fold the paper on the long. Everyone does it on the short. The long is easier to read and is a bit more classy.

Will go to a new thread.

This is what Liturgical Dance can do for YOU.

Here's a routine reminder: Stay on topic.

Sometimes I think the moderator inserts these reminders judiciously rather than randomly.

Folded short folds one more time to go in an envelope when you get home to mail to friends when the Catholic music isn't as Catholic as it could Catholic be.

Isn't there a bit of a learning curve to using InDesign? My husband has it on his computer (he's writing a book) and loves it for that... I don't have the software on my computer and have wondered if it was worth purchasing for my use...

I've used publisher (drives me nuts with some of its quirks) and word (when publisher drove me over the edge).

But then, Adam, you sit sideways. So there's no accounting for taste. :-)

InDesign always seems to need one extra mouseclick than publisher. Need a text box? Click the textbox drawing lasso magnetic toolbox menu tool.

Ain't nobody got time for that.