I think also worth noting, is the list of hymns from the 3rd Edition of the St. Michael Hymnal that will not be included in the 4th Edition of the St. Michael Hymnal.

I'm not sure how it can be said that all three hymnals use 'approximately the same number of traditional hymn tunes'. VII is an entire missal (in fact, more like an encyclopedia!) plus hymn choices for each Sunday of the church year. That's a whole lot fewer hymns than any hymnal contains. VII had a huge job to do in whittling down the choices - JMO could have included twice as many and not gotten everyone's favorites. VII is mostly traditional hymnody, but 'I Received the Living God' isn't, particularly, and the plainsong heritage is there, also.

I was surprised and disappointed in St. Michael, both for the Mass settings based on existing tunes, and the repetition of tunes. Although they try to include a huge swath of styles, to their credit, any competent organist can change a hymn tune to a more familiar one by simply using the Metrical Index of Tunes, so why so much repeating? Why not include some good new hymn tunes, or excellent but less familiar old ones?

I'm starting to think that the problem is not in the editing of hymnals, it's in the lack of creativity among musicians in the USA today. A generation raised on sound bites and jingles has succeeded a generation raised on the chaos of post Vatican II pop style music. Publishers of sheet music have been struggling for a long time and don't take chances on new composers...I used to think there were people with scores in their basements that simply couldn't get into them print. But now I'm beginning to wonder if we've lost creativity altogether. That would mean going back to the Source, the Holy Spirit, who inspired church music to begin with, humbling ourselves, being really trained in our crafts, and ending this constant rush to the bottom of what people are expected to like/know/be able to sing.

@Linda: did you look at the files I posted? I stand by what I said ...

@Adam: I have felt the same frustration, and hence used the current versions to compare.

@Charles: I find the Adoremus choir and organ editions deplorable; each and every hymn requires a page turn, it seems.

BachLover2, fwiw, I don't know how anyone could object to your statistical analysis.

Perhaps it is just wishful thinking, but I am holding out for the new edition of "Hymns, Psalms, and Spiritual Canticles". Are pew books are 26 years old and have been rebound once.

CharlesW

what is combined layering of voices?

@francis

You mean me?

=)

Look at 432 Hail thee, festival day! in Adoremus (choir edition is identical to organ edition, btw). It's when voice layers are arbitrarily combined. It looks confusing.

Friends, a few clarifications, and also a QUESTION:

1. Linda, thank you for pointing out that the Vatican II Hymnal (in spite of the name) is not really a hymnal. It contains so much more (all the readings, Propers, 100 pages of Mass settings, etc.). So comparing it to, for example, the 1982 Hymnal is comparing apples & oranges. Linda, thank you also for pointing out that our effort was to give the BEST and MOST NEEDED and MOST USED hymns . . . not every hymn ever written!

It might be easier to take each comparison separately.

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2. Vatican II Hymnal vs. ADOREMUS Hymnal:

Vatican II Hymnal has approximately the same number of hymns, and more hymn TUNES than the ADOREMUS Hymnal (and this can be seen by comparing indices).

3. Vatican II Hymnal vs. St. Michael's Hymnal:

Vatican II Hymnal has a smaller number of hymns (because St. Michael's also includes contemporary style hymns and uses the same tunes for numerous texts),
. . . but it's true that the Vatican II Hymnal has approximately the same number of traditional hymn TUNES contained in the St. Michael's (if not more).

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As always, I would suggest that we draw a distinction between hymn TEXTS and hymn TUNES. They are not the same.

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QUESTION:

For those unaware, the ADOREMUS skips numbers. That is, the pages go like this: 445, 460, 461, 462, 463, 464, 470, 471, 472, 480, 481, 482, 483, 484, 485, 500, 510, etc.

WHY does it do this?

Thanks: I suspected this was the case, Kathy. However, I cannot express to you the consternation this caused when I convinced the administration at my Catholic High school to buy ADOREMUS (5 years ago).

So many people (priest, principal, vice-principal, etc.) kept saying, "You need to send that Hymnal back, because it is missing pages."

590 For all the saints in Adoremus also has confusing voice layering - especially for the tenors.

BachLover2, thank you for posting indices of the HYMN TUNES from the Vatican II Hymnal, St. Michael's, and ADOREMUS.

This is a very easy way for people to compare the amount of HYMN TUNES in the various books.

I would like to also add the same index, from OCP's "GLORY & PRAISE": Glory & Praise