English versions of Responsories
  • Would someone help me determine whether there is an English version of the Responsory "Vidi dominum facie ad faciem"? Item: of the Communio / Responsory "Discubuit Hiesus et discipuli eius." Are these to be included in the English Propers Project?
  • Adam Bartlett
    Posts: 533
    The SEP will only include settings of the Entrance, Offertory and Communion chants. Where is this chant found? I don't see it in the Graduale.
  • Kathy
    Posts: 5,353
    Are these responsories from the Liturgy of the Hours?
  • The first is I believe for the Second Sunday in Lent, Vespers I believe. I guess it would be in the Antiphonale.

    The second appears to be a Communio or responsorium sub communione originating in the Cistercian use, but I have no other information, perhaps it is an option for Corpus. I have heard a few motets / polyphonic versions, notably that of Jacobus Vaet:
    This latter is really a long-shot, I realize. But one might hope.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 8,628
    An English version might be in the Monastic Diurnale Noted, but I don't have a copy to check.
    Thanked by 1matthaeusglyptes
  • Mike R
    Posts: 106
    You might check out St. Meinrad's responsories; they have a pdf file: http://www.saintmeinradmusic.org/Pages/Products1.html
    Thanked by 1matthaeusglyptes
  • Chris_McAvoyChris_McAvoy
    Posts: 382
    After a year and a half I am significantly experienced, yet still familiarizing myself with the Office.

    I had until you mentioned it not been familiar with this responsory. This is partially because the 1962 form of office books, both secular and benedictine appear to have at some point in the last 500 years suppressed/abandoned this responsory. It appears to have been predominant before the reformation period.

    Those who think that the Benedictine office has been a pristine example of medieval office untampered with are wrong. The hymns may have never have been replaced by Urban, but the antiphons and responsories have certainly had ommissions and exchanges.

    If it had not been tampered with the 14th century Bendictine antiphonaries would match their 20th century counterparts more precisely, which althouth very close, differences exist. St Gertrude the Great, the famous german benedictine, in her famous biography (a classic of latin catholic literature) is documented as singing this particular responsory on the second sunday of lent before mass begins in a procession with the sisters.

    "Vidi dominum facie ad faciem" can be found in latin on this link:
    http://www.humanities.mcmaster.ca/~renwick/Sarum-B-24 , page 24 (935)

    it can also be found in modern notation on this link:
    The Great Responsories of the Divine Office:
    In the transcription .pdf, on page 114.

    Which is a transcription of a Benedictine Antiphonary in the Paris, France vicinity, made around the year 1120 AD.

    This responsory, as far as I know was used at Matins, as the 6th responsory for Matins in the second sunday of lent generally, not Vespers, but perhaps some particular local usage did use it in the evening as well?

    The english translation for the
    Responsory at First Vespers for the Second Sunday in Lent, according to the Sarum rite

    Behold the smell of my son is as the smell of a plentiful field, which the Lord hath blessed;
    God give thee the dew of Heaven, and of the fatness of the Earth, abundance of corn and wine.
    V. Cursed be he that curseth thee, and let him that blesseth thee be filled with blessings.
    (And of the fatness of the Earth, abundance of corn and wine.

    Responsory at Second Vespers for the Second Sunday in Lent, according to the Sarum rite

    Fear God, and keep his commandments: this is the whole duty of man.
    V. They that fear God shall lack nothing; nor they that love Him in Truth.
    This is the whole duty of man

    I have both of these fully notated from the Synod of Milan's office books. (the best english plainchant office ever made) They are the creme de la creme of office. However they do actually still miss some of the responsories from matins, but every other part of the temporale is there and long prolix responsories for vespers are complete. I may have to publish te matins prolix responsories in english myself if they do not exist.

    If I had enough time or interest I would adapt it to english for you right now.
    Perhaps next lent..It would not take very long it's a fairly short responsory.
    It is certainly on the long list of things to do.
    Thanked by 1matthaeusglyptes
  • Is the Nocturnale Romanum still available? It would have more-or-less everything.

    I'm confused ... Milanese Office ... the best ENGLISH plainchant Office???