Change, it's happening.
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,605
    image

    Take a careful look at the column of other YouTube videos offered on the right.

    Corpus Christi Watershed has a presence and we all know it is having an effect.

    Thanks, Jeff!
  • Cantate
    Posts: 33
    Also worth noticing is the average age of the "musicians"...
  • SamuelDorlaque
    Posts: 318
    Each of us has an obligation to teach the young as much as we can of the "Treasury of Sacred Music."
  • Jeffrey CogginsJeffrey Coggins
    Posts: 360
    Also worth noticing is the average age of the "musicians"...


    As well as the shirt he is wearing ... I can tell you, this is no coincidence.
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,605
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p92dIVjrkO4&feature=related

    At request, a live link -
  • Blaise
    Posts: 439
    Alright, good thing I'm not eating or drinking something, because I would have either choked on solid food and spewed out my drink. And the harmonica (?)? It sounds ridiculous. (:

    It is quite sad, because yesterday I was looking for examples on Lutheran worship on youtube. I have yet to see anything outlandish like this.

    I have nothing against blues music or the like....in the secular world. But some of us do not come to Mass in order to be reminded of the secular world....we come to be reminded that there is someone who transcends this world.

    If we Catholics claim to have the very Body and Blood of Christ Jesus present underneath the disguise of bread and wine, why is the exterior appearance of our worship sometimes worse than the Protestants? Should we not vie with them.....for reverence?

    I bless the Lord that I sing in a choir at a church which does not have this "upbeat" music. Maybe I can take over the music program at a nearby church......who needs someone to practice his conducting skills? :) Seriously though, I'm going to be spending some time next year studying the liturgical books and chant.

    Here is an agreement I propose: I agree not to sing Palestrina, etc., at the campfire; you agree not to sing this stuff at the Holy Sacrifice of the Altar. What do you say?

    Kuddos to MusicaSacra and Corpus Christi Watershed. With the grace of God and your work, these Blues Masses and the ilk....these, too, "will come to pass".
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,605
    It's especially difficult as this is from a parish that is hard at work and let by a wonderful priest.
  • Jeffrey Quick
    Posts: 2,048
    "I agree not to sing Palestrina, etc., at the campfire"

    Even if you do a camping retreat with your schola?
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    wow, this video poses a real challenge to those who say that any style is suitable at Mass.

    this article doesn't address this case in particular but it deals with something more pervasive, the youth rock Mass.
  • Jeffrey CogginsJeffrey Coggins
    Posts: 360
    I have nothing against blues music or the like....in the secular world. But some of us do not come to Mass in order to be reminded of the secular world....we come to be reminded that there is someone who transcends this world.


    I love this quote, Paul Viola.

    I also love the viola, actually.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    The two problems with blues music at St. Julie's:
    1. It's a parody of Mass
    2. It's a parody of Blues music.


    If #1 is not convincing enough, perhaps someone could mount a case based on #2.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    PS.

    I noticed on their "Lamb of God" video that:
    As this clip begins, the congregation is still involved in the handshake of peace.


    The handshake of peace?
    Awesome.


    I thought at first it was a joke (like, the video was posted by some snarky anti-blues-mass abuse exposer. Sadly, no. The poster is quite sincere, and St. Julie's liturgy apparently includes a handshake of peace.
    This brings up another point- when music like this is happening, there's generally a confusion about liturgy in general, aside from the music itself.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    Watching it without sound is the funniest thing ever.
  • benedictgal
    Posts: 798
    Gavin, or the scariest...
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,605
    Mention of the rock Mass.

    It would be of interest to survey and profile the people involved in the average parish. It takes a certain kind of personality to take up a microphone in front of people and sing, as well as choosing to play guitar and keyboards at Mass. Many teenagers find the music at masses created for them to be embarrassing. Very embarrassing.

    I would hazard a guess that the majority of these groups were formed at the instigation of an adult - who thought that it would reach the teens, rather than by the desire of teens themselves.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    Mind if I tell the truth here? Since my teens are only 7 years past...

    Most teens (and adults) would rather fornicate and abuse controlled substances than go to church, whatever the music.

    I've yet to see nearly anyone address this in "youth ministry". Anything else is rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    PPS

    On the plus side, this insanity apparently only happens once a year at this parish.
    I'm assuming, though, that the regular Sunday music that this is pre-empting is not, um... particularly more suitable?
    ---


    I love Blues music. This is painful to listen to AS MUSIC, even when I ignore the liturgical implications here.

    I can almost imagine a Blues-inspired Mass setting that would come close to being appropriate for worship, but it would need to reach back into the Gospel-music origins of the genre, and not get mired in the night-club, commercialized, white-man blues that have come to dominate the genre over the last 50 years or so. Hardly likely in a white suburban parish in California.


    And again, as I have been with several attempts at Liturgi-tainment, I'd like to point out that this doesn't even jibe well with what most "progressives" would describe as their liturgical goals. There can be no active participation in such a performance-based, difficult to sing idiom. It pretends to be egalitarian (everyone recognizes it), but it is at least as elitist (participation-wise) as a polyphonic motet. And unlike the motet, this music exalts the performer in a way that is neither appropriate to a conservative idea of liturgical propriety nor a liberal idea of liturgical egalitarianism.

    Uninformed pseudo-liberals could make some kind of an argument based on "Mass is a celebration," but I might point out:
    Yes it is.
    So what are we celebrating?
    Nightclubs and bars celebrate debauchery and drunkeness.
    The House of Blues and the Hard Rock Cafe celebrate profit-making.
    Traditional Blues music celebrates perseverance amidst communal suffering.
    What, in particular, is Mass a celebration of?
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    Most teens (and adults) would rather fornicate and abuse controlled substances than go to church, whatever the music.
    I've yet to see nearly anyone address this in "youth ministry". Anything else is rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.


    Which is why Mass should seem more like the places where you go to fornicate and abuse controlled substances. Clearly, teens go to clubs and parties FOR THE MUSIC.
  • matthewjmatthewj
    Posts: 2,696
    Part of the problem is that most people have never heard the phrase "perfect, unbloody sacrifice" and think Mass is just a prayer service. If you explain to them what Mass really is and get them to actually accept it, they'd likely change their views on music.

    Make them watch Mel Gibson's Passion movie on mute with bluegrass or blues playing.
  • Blaise
    Posts: 439
    Jeffrey Coggins:

    I plan on playing the viola someday. I like it's sound compared to the brightness of a violin. :)

    Jeffrey Quick:

    "Even if you do a camping retreat with your schola?"

    Welllll, now....we gotta be fair if we are going to make the case that some music belongs here, some there.....:)

    Jeffrey Tucker:

    I saw the Simple Propers attached to your article at Chant Cafe. It appears to me to be like the Minor Propers used in an Anglican Use Mass. Kudos to Adam Bartlett, et al., for their work. But as you said, we have to convince the musicians to get away from their guitars, etc. Perhaps one approach would be to allow them to play the Simple Propers on their instruments while singing them at Mass for some time, then after a while take away their instruments by encouraging them to let their own instruments, that is, their voices, do the work. It's just like getting a starving person for a while to eat: give them a whole meal at one time for their first time eating, and their body will reject it. But give them something a little bit at a time, eventually they will be able to eat a meal.
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