I'd suggest the answer is catechesis. If we were faced with a congregation that did not say any responses, would that not be the answer? I suppose I would take the time to say to people, perhaps in the bulletin, "this congregation does an excellent job of internally participating in the sung portions of the Mass. But I encourage you to consider the importance of your external participation. You may find it spiritually beneficial" or something less ridiculous sounding.

It should be kept in mind that this is hypothetical. All congregations WILL sing something, whether it's the Snow Pater Noster, the Simplex Mode VI Alleluia, or On Eagle's Wings. However, I think considering the proposed hypothetical is a worthwhile pursuit. Also, I don't know about anyone else, but it sounds to me like this is a congregation that will not sing, as opposed to one that cannot. Hence I think catechesis (more than, for example, making the music easier or a concerted teaching effort) is the way to go.

Just chant the Propers and Ordinary yourself. That 1 in 15 will help you with the Ordinary. The rest can participate internally.

I'd rather respond to real situations than hypotheticals. This one sounds like it has several negative factors at once, which might not be the case with a real situation.

But prescinding from that: does the priest sing the dialogue portions of the Mass?

Here's another question: Need this be a concern? I'm all in favor of robust, loud congregational song, so I'm only asking as a question... do they really need to sing? You specified there is a good choir, so surely they can come up with something for the processions. Choral ordinary as well. I have a hard time imagining a situation where one cannot transition to totally sung responses, so one can actually wind up with a very good program even with this hypothetical congregation. I'm just asking, what would be wrong with the priest and music director accepting that the congregation will not sing?

Just realized that all the congregations this group are part of have the choir/guitar group/organist and singers up in front of them. So one element that leads them in participation, if they do participate back in their home parishes, is missing visually here.

I think the most natural way to have the congregation sing is to have priest chant his part and help him to do so. It is impossible not to respond in chanting when priest chants. About two years ago I heard for the first time priest chanting in English, of course in NO Mass (It was Daniel's previous parish where he was the director.). It was such a wonderful experience for me. The whole Mass was a beautiful prayer. (with Propers, Ordinaries and a couple of motets and hymns). Chanting responses is so easy and natural and gives the reluctant congregation a confidence. (also because chanting is very close to speaking.) After they get used to chanting the responses, I think people can move on to other singing more naturally. I've seen enough parishes who failed, musically and spritiually,to have congregation sing by forcing them to sing many hymns and 'casual , pop style' contemporary music. Maybe it worked in protestant churches, because robust hymn singing IS their tradition. But in Cahtolic churches non musical people are happy with more listening, contemplation and interal participations, it is very unrealistic to expect Catholics to do robust hymn singing like protestants. If we want the Catholics to sing our Liturgies, so 'Sing Like Catholics,' I believe we need to help priests to chant their parts first. I noticed when my pastor started to chant and sing Kyrie and Agnus Dei, people sing much more than when the choir and even schola lead them. So if the pastor and the music director think congregation singing is important in their parish, the pastor has to make time to learn to chant his parts. Many priests are busy and don't realize this, so musicians in parishes need to help them (probably just a little bit at a time), also because what I heard from this forum is that they don't get much help in chanting and singing in the seminary, even if the bishops' "Sing to the Lord" clearly put emphasis on priests' singing.

I respectfully disagree with Paix. In this case, the congregation is not singing. The last thing that should be done is to ignore that fact. Take away the congregational singing, and if they object say "We will return a congregational Gloria when the responses are well sung," then "We will return to a hymn after Mass when the Gloria is well sung," etc. Of course, Noel's situation seems to presuppose that the priest and music director are both of a mind to improve the liturgy and not merely make people feel smug.

Two things to try, both have worked for me within a parish and especially with a mix of people from several parishes

1- *basic* shared repertoire of chant hymns and tradtional (solid older) hymns
2- unaccompanied chant ordinaries, our Father, etc.
Without an organ doing the work for them, the average person in the pew will often feel nudged into singing what the choir is singing, so long as it's basic enough.

I agree that instruction from the pastor is important, too.

For the N.O., if the celebrant proceeds in accord with #29 of Musicam Sacram, I'm convinced that the congregation will sing. That instruction by the Sacred Congregation of Rites mandates that all of the 1st degree of participation must be sung before any of the 2nd or 3rd degree may be sung.

29. The following belong to the first degree:

(a) In the entrance rites: the greeting of the priest together with the reply of the people; the prayer.

(b) In the Liturgy of the Word: the acclamation at the Gospel.

(c) In the Eucharistic Liturgy: the prayer over the offerings; the preface with its dialogue and the Sanctus; the final doxology of the Canon, the Lord's prayer with its introduction and embolism; the Pax Domini; the prayer after the Communion; the formulas of dismissal.

N.b. No hymns, propers, motets, anthems, etc. unless all the above are being sung. Notice too that all the above in the 1st degree require the active participation of the celebrant.