French Diction
  • Susdem
    Posts: 36
    Hi all,

    What are your favorite resources for French diction? One of my high schoolers who is taking French as her language in high school requested that we sing a traditional French Christmas carol about the Christ child that's actually quite delightful. I found a very nice SSA arrangement and am going to have a group of middle school and high school girls sing it. I was planning to introduce IPA to them this year anyway so want to use this as a great teaching moment. French is the language I've worked with the least, though, so I'll definitely have to do some prep work myself.

    Thanks in advance!
    Susan
  • ServiamScores
    Posts: 3,376
    just post it here and I'll speak it for you. The problem with french is that there is a disparity between how it is spoken and how it is sung. Silent syllables aren't quite so silent when sung.
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen Abbysmum
  • Susdem
    Posts: 36
    Thanks, ServiamScores. This is the score I'm using, available on the composer's website linked through CPDL. I do also want to use this as a lesson in French diction (writing it in their scores in IPA, etc...) and teaching the rules so still looking for recommendations on books for that as well.

    I read some translations of the text. It's a beautiful text!

    https://www.vocalpdf.nl/arr.htm#vrouwenkoor
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • Susdem
    Posts: 36
    Looks like my attachment didn't attach. The carol is Entre le Boeuf et L'ane Gris and can be accessed through the website above.
  • Musicguy57
    Posts: 27
    There is a great classic called Singing in French by Thomas Grubb. was published by Schirmer
  • ServiamScores
    Posts: 3,376
    This is a very lovely recording by a french choir. It is all correct (as one would expect).

    https://youtu.be/nc9a0AoNdw8?si=bIC8KSfZBvMd8Gzd

    Also attached, I speak through it. I looked at the first CPDL score which only set the first verse, but then go back and speak the rest.
    entre le boeuf et l ane gris pronunciation.mp3
    6M
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • Susdem
    Posts: 36
    Thank you! It was very kind of you to speak through the text. This is outside my usual comfort zone but I LOVE that one of my choristers took the initiative to request that we take on the challenge of a carol in French. I also really like the piece.
    Thanked by 2ServiamScores CHGiffen
  • SponsaChristi
    Posts: 848
    The problem with french is that there is a disparity between how it is spoken and how it is sung. Silent syllables aren't quite so silent when sung.

    There’s also the issue of dialect. Are we singing Parisian French or Québécois French?

    I’ve tried to find a pronunciation guide for the Canadian National Anthem’s French lyrics, which are also the Catholic lyrics, for two years now. Singing the bilingual version from memory last minute is now expected of the chorus I’m in, but the only pronunciation instructions are “with a Québécois accent”. I have yet to find one. I have even gone so far as writing the Department of Heritage and requesting an official pronunciation guide.
  • ServiamScores
    Posts: 3,376
    or Québécois French?
    doubtful. In any event, I'd recommend against it. American choirs generally seek to sing in "proper" English tones, and I'd recommend exactly the same treatment where French is concerned. (That is, sing in proper continental French, not a transatlantic dialect.)
  • Charles_Weaver
    Posts: 258
    I second the Grubb recommendation.
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,795
    I always second grub(b).
  • kevinfkevinf
    Posts: 1,280
    Haha...my French wife sings in the Northern accent known as Chti. She can sing also in the Parisian accent. But we have friends who speak in the South. Who is right? Depends on who you ask. Parisian is considered "good" but a lot of French people resent that statement. Paris is not the only tongue. I can say that generally following the IPA is fine but hearing the different accents is a lot of fun. Personally, I love the Toulouse accent. And also the Swiss accent is fun. Quebecois...yeah its okay but really far from the IPA. There are reasons for that. French TV usually speaks in a kind of non-accent,so as not to offend anyone. But it can be kind of boring. I like people from Brittany to speak with a Breton accent, not Parisian. And then there is Occitan and other regional tongues.

    de gustibus.....
  • SponsaChristi
    Posts: 848
    Who is right?

    I know this is a rhetorical question, but I suppose the same rule could be applied as choosing which English enunciations to use when singing a particular work. For example, my chorus sang Vaughan Williams’, A Sea Symphony, which uses the poetry of the American poet, Walt Whitman. A question was raised whether or not to use American English enunciation or British enunciation, since Vaughan Williams was a British (more precisely, an English) composer. Things get interesting when you’re singing a work from Newfoundland.

    Applying this to French, since I am in Canada, if I were singing a French-Canadian piece of music, Québécois French would be more appropriate, as would it be so singing the bilingual version of O Canada. That being said, I noticed that my niece and nephew are taught both Canadian French and Parisian French, so there’s diversity in French even in Canada.
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,795
    New World immersion programs in particular struggle to get New World native speakers even when those varieties are more acceptable and the standard is no longer French French (I don’t think that Parisian French is appropriate as a description), in part because these years abroad are prestigious for the French. The downside is that they go back to France for various reasons (immigration, they’re just done; their contracts can’t be renewed again…) and there is a lot of turnover year over year.

    In Ontario especially the kids speak their own variety since it’s (mostly) all French but with more nonnative speakers and competing native varieties among adults. Irish winds up being a bit similar although it’s a bit worse because elements of the official variety taught in school are mutually exclusive of elements found in some varieties spoken by native speakers!
  • Felicia
    Posts: 171
    The text of A Sea Symphony is by Walt Whitman.
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen SponsaChristi
  • Musicguy57
    Posts: 27
    Just saw it - The American Choral Directors Association Choral journal is all about French choral music andhas an article about teaching French. Might be worth a look
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • SponsaChristi
    Posts: 848
    The text of A Sea Symphony is by Walt Whitman.

    Oops! Corrected that. Thanks!
    Thanked by 1Felicia
  • Felicia
    Posts: 171
    No worries!
  • probe
    Posts: 248
    Thanks @musicguy57.
    September 2026 ACDA Journal
    Jules Massenet and the Orpheon Tradition
    -Revisiting Pierre Villette
    -An Interview with Stephen Layton
    -The Choruses of Georges Bizet
    -A Stepwise Approach to Teaching French Diction
    -The Use of French Latin for Choral Music
    -Designing the Community Chorus


    My wife is rehearsing some Fauré pieces and used these resources:

    https://youtu.be/rVpoJh9Gnlw

    https://youtu.be/bxpoHjDfyIo

    https://youtu.be/gXiAsks7X-c


    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,795
    Oh that’s all interesting stuff. Nice. Maybe I can get the PDF from someone.
Add a Comment