transitioning to TLM, where to begin
  • LarsLars
    Posts: 142
    I need help learning the traditional liturgy from an organist/DoM point of view.
  • rvisser
    Posts: 95
    I found the Chant Tools app/website to be very helpful for learning the TLM because it has the propers in order (with psalm tone options if necessary) and you can select whichever Mass Ordinary setting you want. Sometimes this was easier than flipping pages in a book because there is SO MUCH MUSIC in the first 15 minutes of the liturgy.
    Thanked by 1Lars
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,981
    This may help,
    https://lms.org.uk/scholas-guide-sung-mass
    or this,
    https://stbedeschoirblog.wordpress.com
    Thanked by 2Lars JonathanLC
  • francis
    Posts: 11,386
    Here is a booklet for printing using the link that tomjaw provided
    scholasGuideBooklet.pdf
    41K
    Thanked by 3Lars tomjaw JonathanLC
  • GambaGamba
    Posts: 669
    https://media.churchmusicassociation.org/books/7848318-Psallite-Sapienter-A-Musicians-Guide-to-the-Extraordinary-Form.pdf

    https://musicasacra.com/2008/05/psallite-sapienter/

    Luckily, CMAA created just such a book a few years ago!
    Thanked by 5Charles_Weaver Lars tomjaw CHGiffen rich_enough
  • Charles_Weaver
    Posts: 250
    Andrew's wonderful Psallite sapienter was extremely valuable when I was starting out with the TLM. It is highly recommended. As I have traveled more widely in the years since, I have come to see a more flexible view of how things are done, especially with regard to the use of the organ. But it is still the best place to start.
    Thanked by 3Lars tomjaw CHGiffen
  • francis
    Posts: 11,386
    Charles

    I am curious about your opinion about use of organ… please elaborate!
    Thanked by 1Lars
  • Chant_Supremacist
    Posts: 341
    It says a couple of things about no organ at all in Advent and Lent (Gaudete and Laetare excepted, as is support of singing) - which I personally agree with, though I think custom can play a role - but also deprecates organ with congregational responses, which I would agree goes overboard, if that's where Charles is going with it. It's a great book though, I agree with the recommendations.
    Thanked by 1Lars
  • LarsLars
    Posts: 142
    than you all, this has been very helpful.
  • Palestrina
    Posts: 600
    Chant_Supremacist, I don’t know that I’d say that the custom of using organ in Lent and Advent apart from for very specific accompanimental purposes should ever be followed - the appendices to Hayburn are littered with dubia on this and similar points with answers from the Congregation in very strong, negative terms.

    That said, I do think custom can play a significant role where the law is silent or unclear, provided that the conditions for its establishment are legitimate. I think of the guidance in Marcel Dupre’s book on organ technique as a nice encapsulation of the customs in Paris at the time he wrote the book, for instance.
    Thanked by 1Chant_Supremacist
  • KVH50
    Posts: 7
    How prevalent are accompanied responses? I've inherited the custom in my position, and find that it does help with keeping the congregation's responses together (on time, in tempo). That said, I certainly see how introducing it in new places could be seen as overboard.
  • Chant_Supremacist
    Posts: 341
    From what I've seen and restricting to TLMs, not prevalent (maybe sub 10%), but everywhere I've seen it done had fantastic music, robust congregational singing, and a beautiful all-around celebration of the mass. I'm not suggesting any cause and effect, it just doesn't ime correlate with bad liturgy or tasteless musicianship at all, quite the opposite. Anecdotal, mileage may vary.

    Edit: I'm also not suggesting new places should take it up, I just see it as entirely unproblematic.
    Thanked by 2KVH50 StimsonInRehab
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,713
    I personally dislike accompanying the short responses.

    The one place where I heard accompaniment for the short responses had rather weak congregational singing, and occasionally the organ was used to get the reciting tone back up to the preference of the other priests and the choirmaster when there was a visiting cleric, which is hardly ideal, unless it’s too low for even the choir (too high is probably not the case). The rest of the music was very good, and I have a lot of respect for the musician who ran that program for a long time.

    In France I think that it’s overdone: the timing is not as fluid IMHO.

    When our organ is available, I do prefer that the Benedicamus of the Office be accompanied (this is allowed, it’s not a minister’s part) along with the response and if possible the Deo gratias of the Mass, since the Kyrie is already accompanied. I suppose I have to think about whether the Ite is accompanied for the Easter vigil and Sunday, as we did not have organ this year, and my brain is now mush.

    In any case I would not get rid of that at least not right away. But you might find that it’s helpful to wean folks off of it.

    @Lars also please feel free to DM me. I have the happy experience of also having a very good handle on the clergy and servers’ side of things in addition to musical things.

    The real challenge is fluidity: it won’t always be perfect, or you might realize that the timing is not going to work, but people should learn to move before one piece ends (introit to Kyrie for example) so that pitches can be given quickly (my rule is 10-15 seconds while making sure that everyone is good before starting…)
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