July 4th (USA), Ordinary Form
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,155
    Does anyone know if the "Mass of St. Thomas Jefferson & Companions" is compulsory in the Ordinary Form on July 4th in the USA, or if another Mass (say, Votive of the Immaculate Conception) may be used.
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  • Salieri,

    This (the Mass of St. Thomas Jefferson) is a joke, I trust?
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,155

    It is truly right and just...through Christ our Lord.
    He spoke to us a message of peace
    and taught us to live as brothers and sisters.
    His message took form in the vision of our founding fathers
    as they fashioned a nation
    where we might live as one.
    His message lives on in our midst
    as our task for today and a promise for tomorrow.
    And so, with hearts full of love,
    we join the angels today and every day of our lives,
    to sing your glory as we acclaim: Holy, &c.
  • PLTT
    Posts: 138
    I assume he was being facetious about the propers written for the day.

    For multiple reasons, it is optional. The Proper Calendar lists it as an equivalent of the optional memorials, and the Mass itself does not seem to be directly prescribed in the way that a Mass is prescribed for the Day of Prayer [Jan 22]. Thus any Votive Mass [or Various Needs Mass, or Mass for the Dead] may be celebrated on that day, since it is Ordinary Time.

    Even if it WERE the equivalent of an obligatory memorial, the priest could opt to use a Votive Mass if it were deemed a case of "real necessity or pastoral advantage" considering the good of the congregation where the Mass is being celebrated.

  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,041
    The authors of that text missed an opportunity: they could have written: "where many might live as one", and thus allude to "E pluribus unum".
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen Elmar
  • Jeffrey Quick
    Posts: 1,968
    Everybody knows that the Feast of St. Jefferson (also know as Feast of the Freemasons) is normally transferred to Caesar Sunday in the USA.
    Thanked by 2StimsonInRehab Elmar
  • GambaGamba
    Posts: 514
    Good Lord, who wrote that preface? I couldn't believe it was real, until I saw it in the Missal.

    ...his message took form in the vision of our founding fathers...

    Three-fifths of several million slaves would certainly disagree.
    Thanked by 2Elmar PaxMelodious
  • Gamba,

    Salieri's NOT joking?

    Disbelief has sent me looking for proof, and the only saving grace I can see in this Preface is that "He" doesn't refer to Thomas Jefferson in the original, but to Christ, Our Lord. Nevertheless, bending the preface text to make it conform to our national naval gazing strikes me as maladroit, to say nothing of wrong-headed.

    Imagine the Germans using this text:

    A royal priesthood, a people set apart.....

    or the Italian trainworkers' union Mass having this text:

    the last shall be first, and the first, last.

    Or the Muslim in the Caliphate using this one:

    The People who walked in Darkness have seen a great light.

    At least when a play on words exists in the older collects, it is clever and thoughtful.
    Thanked by 1Elmar
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,761
    And still no propers for the Mass of John Adams on July 2nd....
    Thanked by 1RMSawicki
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,067
    Why July 2nd for John Adams? Jefferson and Adams both died on July 4th, 1826, the 50th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence.
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,761
    Because the actual resolution for independence was adopted on July 2nd - technically, that's the date of American independence. There was another 2 days of fierce debate over the declaration to explain the resolution, which declaration was approved on the 4th. Adams, having shouldered the lead role in the floor debate in favor, famously wrote to Abigail on the 3rd: "The Second Day of July 1776, will be the most memorable Epocha, in the History of America."


    You don't remember the Bicentennial Minute of July 2, 1976 any more, do you? (Actually, it was more than that, but some particular attention to the 2nd was paid in 1976. Not sure that will happen in the coming Semiquincentenary.)

    Speaking of which: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=f_ffW8VCbbA

    From the NY Times on July 2, 1976:

    "Adams Saw Celebrations Marking Memorable Epoch in America - on July 2"

    John Adams was an extraordinary correspondent. But on July 3. 1776—just one day after Congress voted independence from England—he was extraordinary to a fault. The events of the previous day had been so momentous that one letter to his wife could not contain his emotions—so he wrote her two. One of them declared.

    “The second day of July 1776 will be the most memorable epoch in the history of America. I am apt to believe that it will be celebrated by suceeding generations as the great anniversary festival. It ought to be commemorated as the day of deliverance by solemn acts of devotion to God Almighty. It ought to be solemnized with pomp and parade, with shows, games, sports, guns, bells, bonfires and illuminations from one end of this continent to the other from this time forward forevermore.”

    John Adams may have been a “Colossus”—Thomas Jefferson called him that. He may have been “the Atlas of American independence”—Richard Stockton, a New Jersey delegate to the Con tinental Congress, hailed him thus. But, let it be whispered from the housetops, Adams's, prediction was slightly off the mark.

    For even though July 2 was the day Congress voted for independence—for that new nation conceived in bondage and finally dedicated to liberty—July 4 has by tradition become the day solemnized, and also trivialized, from the continent's end to end.

    [snipping out many paragraphs....]

    Final Arguments

    On July I, in the heat of a threatening summer storm, Congress formed itself into a committee of the whole to hear the final arguments for and against separation. John Dickinson of Pennsylvania argued long and eloquently against the project. He warned of a dark period ahead, without foreign aid; the colonies had much to do at home—settle land claims, establish governments, unite about a constitution joining them into a nation.

    Meanwhile, the committee he headed, which was drafting articles of confederation, was arguing every point so vigorously that it might never agree on “reasonable terms of Confederation.” Dickinson foresaw the likelihood of civil war and the dissolution of the confederation within 30 years. John Adams sat silent, waiting for someone “less obnoxious than myself.” as he wrote in his autobiography. to carry the argument against Dickinson. Finally he rose. A ‘Simple’ Question He began by saying that he wished “for the talents and eloquence of the ancient orators of Greece and Rome,” but then suggested that the question appeared “so simple” that he was confident he could reply to all objections. Nine colonies sided with the Adams position and voted in favor of independence; Pennsylvania and South Carolina opposed: Delaware was split; New York did not vote. Without Pennsylvania and New York the colonies could hardly act. At that point, Rutledge suggested postponing the question till the next day, suggesting that—though opposed — South Carolina's delegates would approve “for the sake of unanimity.” And so—on July 2—they did. When those within the Pennsylvania delegation who opposed independence—Dickinson and Robert Morris—abstained, that colony added its vote in favor. Delaware's Caesar Rodney, alerted to the crisis, arrived just in time, mud‐spattered, exhausted by his 80‐mile ride through night and day and wind and storm. He broke the tie in his delegation—and voted for independence. That left only New York, whose delegates assured Congress of their personal support, but pleaded that their year‐old instructions gave them no freedom to vote against reconciliation with Britain. New York's Vote By mid‐July New York voted in favor—thus uniting all 13 colonies in the ranks of the rebellious. But rebellion, however principled, is not always doomed to victory. Delegates to Congress were still digesting the bad news from Canada, trying to find an explanation, or a scapegoat, for the rout there of Patriot forces. At the same time, Congress was calling for moderation in dealing with loyalists, letting it be known that no man charged with being a tory or unfriendly to America's liberty “be injured in his person or his property. No one was, sure where the enemy would strike next. From Virginia, Madison wrote a friend in Pennsylvania: “We have as great unanimity and as much of the military ardor as you can possibly have in your government. . . . The most inexpert hands reckon it an indifferent shot to miss the bigness of a man's face at the distance’ of 100 yards.”

    Confided His Fears

    He confided his fears that “our royal Governor has been tampering with the slaves. To say the truth, that is the only part in which this colony is vulnerable; and if we should be subdued, we shall fall like Achilles by the hand of one that knows that secret.”

    Congress struggled to deal with details of military preparedness, decided to raise “one battalion of Germans,” and even resolved “that the pay of such soldiers at New York as have been enlisted at five dollars per month be raised to six dollars and twothirds per month.”

    “The army continues healthy,” Colonel Loammi Baldwin, on duty at North River, New York, wrote his wife in Massachusetts. “The whores (by information) continue their imploy which is become very lucrative. these bitchfoxly jades, jilts, haggs, strums, prostitutes ...”

    On June 29, watchers on Staten Island sighted the fleet which had evacuated British troops from Bostonover a hundred square‐riggers. Couriers rode off to Connecticut and New Jersey to urge the militia there to hurry to the defense. On July 1 the British fleet moved to within a half‐mile of the Long Island shore.

    ‘Rebels Observed’

    “We observed a good many of the rebels in motion on shore,” noted Archibald Robertson, a British officer. “They fired musketry at the nearest ships without effect. Lucky for us the Rebels had no cannon here or we must have suffered a good deal.”

    The first British soldiers landed on Staten Island without opposition, Robertson reported, “the inhabitants welcoming them ashore.”

    It was hardly a fitting prelude to the Congress vote for independence, hardly a favorable omen for the debate that followed—line by line, word by word—on Jefferson's great declaration.

    But Congress went doggedly ahead. After the crucial vote on July 2. Adams sat down to write his Abigail: “Yesterday the greatest question was decided, which ever was debated in America. and a greater perhaps, never was or will be decided among men. . . . Britain has been filled with folly, and America with wisdom, at least, this is my judgment. Time must determine. It is the will of heaven that the two countries should be sundered forever.”
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen RMSawicki
  • a_f_hawkins
    Posts: 3,233
    I see there is an alternative preface which includes "He loved the children of the lands He walked ..." That seems not to be masonic, but to have strayed from certain golden pages.
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,067
    Liam, I'm well aware of the resolution for independence being adopted on July 2nd, 1776, as well as the Declaration of Independence (document) being ratified and signed on July 4th. I often chide my friends and family that the the colonies adopted the resolution of independence on the same day of the year as my birthday (July 2nd), but for some reason they choose to celebrate the country's independence on my father's birthday (July 4th).

    But ... usually, when referring to saints, it is their day of death that is memorialized, which for Adams and Jefferson is July 4th ... hence the point I raised in my previous post.
  • Was your dad excluded from the discussions, Charles? (I'm feeling old,myself, but lightheartedly)
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  • Liam
    Posts: 4,761
    Yes, but sometimes we choose a date associated with their most significant, um, charism.

    And James Monroe died 5 years later.

    Happy birthday, and many more of them!
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,067
    Indeed, Monroe died on July 4th, 1781.1831, 5 years after Adams and Jefferson.
  • Elmar
    Posts: 484
    As a native German, I cannot resist extending:
    ...a people set apart to make, by its very nature, the world a healthier place...

    Chris, you made my day!
  • Jeffrey Quick
    Posts: 1,968
    It's REAL?
    I retract my purple.
    I am aghast.
    Thanked by 1Salieri
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,835
    Not going to be there tomorrow. If they throw nuns with guitars off the building, I will sadly miss it all. Oh, well...

    Thought I should put that in purple, lest the outraged nun geetar twangers riot in front of my house tonight.
  • cesarfranck
    Posts: 143
    Monroe did not die in 1781. He died in 1831. I love this thread!
    Thanked by 2WGS CHGiffen
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,155
    Jeffrey Quick July 2 Unthank
    Posts: 1,488
    It's REAL?
    I retract my purple.
    I am aghast.

    Does this shock you? Amen, amen I say unto you: unless therefore ye render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and worship him as god, ye hath not Patriotism within you. For I say, unless ye drink of paper cups emblazoned with the flag and wear it also as boxer-shorts, ye are not truly American.
    Thanked by 2tomjaw Elmar
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,067
    Oops, 1831, 5 years after Adams and Jefferson died is the correct date of Monroe's death ... thanks, cesarfranck.
    Thanked by 1cesarfranck
  • Salieri,

    I think I know that you're representing a point of view not your own in your last comment.
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,155

    It was in response to Jeffrey Quick's remark, my comment is edited to more clearly shew that. And, yes, it should be read with more purple than the Forum can probably muster.

    I will not mention my own political opinions here, as I don't believe it is really the right forum for that (no pun intended). If you have a burning desire to know, you can PM me. Suffice to say, my right-wing friends tend to think I'm a lefty, my left-wing friends tend to think I'm an ultra-conservative. Which means, I'm probably pretty centrist. Go figure.
    Thanked by 2cesarfranck CharlesW
  • Salieri,

    I wouldn't mind that conversation, but I won't press the question here. I'm glad I understood that the reason it wasn't in purple is that the well was already dry, not that you meant it seriously.

  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,835
    I thought this was all a joke until I got out the ordo and looked. Nothing to laugh about and no purple.
    Thanked by 1Elmar
  • CatherineS
    Posts: 690
    I thought this was a joke, too!

    Salieri - my friends and family think the same.
    Thanked by 1CharlesW
  • StimsonInRehabStimsonInRehab
    Posts: 1,889
    Thanked by 2RMSawicki CharlesW
  • RMSawicki
    Posts: 107
    Regarding propers for a Mass for John Adams (as per Liam):

    I'll be the first to write a Mass setting for the "Feast of the Marriage of John and Abigail, Parents of the USA" - October 25th.


    Gaudete in Domino Semper!
  • Propers for a Patriotic Mass

    Rex George tyrannus fuit qui subintroierunt explorare libertatem nostram. Ps. 2. Quare fremuerunt gentes, et populi meditati sunt inania?
    Seditio libertate filiorum peperit. v. Post rubra vestimenta fieldstone moenibus percussit nos.
    Si unus terram; si utrumque mare.
    Creator autem si una tantum, sed maxime ex toto Bibliorum.
    AL t. p.
    Ego sum paenitet me quod uno modo animam meam pro patriae reddere.
    Puer George Washington succidit cerasus arbore. Et non potuerunt indicare mendacium.
    Ea est antiquis vexillum magnam, quæ est summus vexillum volantes.
  • RMSawicki
    Posts: 107
    Love it!

    Gaudete in Domino Semper!
  • (yes,
    Quare fremuerunt gentes, et populi meditati sunt inania?
    ) but which populi are inania, and which gentes are fremuerenting?
    Thanked by 2chonak Salieri