Sharpthorne
  • m_r_taylor
    Posts: 314
    I'm not extremely familiar with the corpus of hymn tunes, so it was a pleasure at a daily Mass the other day to sing something completely new for me - SHARPTHORNE 12.12.12 (Worship III #624), written by Erik Routley, a Congregationalist minister with a nice ear for composition. It's dignified with a little touch of harmonic lushness, and that one 6/4 measure in the middle makes the whole thing breathe nicely. Most of all...how do I put this...it doesn't hit you over the head screaming that it's a hymn.

    Anyways, just wanted to register my appreciation for a nice little hymn tune.
    Thanked by 2Joseph Michael cesarfranck
  • Paul F. Ford
    Posts: 857
    Thanks for the reminder of this fine hymn.
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,942
    For folks unfamiliar with this hymn:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMTIlMSCH7g
    Thanked by 2Joseph Michael eft94530
  • Paul F. Ford
    Posts: 857
    Thanks, Liam.
  • Joseph Michael
    Posts: 254
    One of the most pleasant sacred music occasions of my life was a day spent (in clinics) with Erik Routley circa 1980 in London, Ontario. During the day and at the big hymn festival that he led that night, we sang all of his hymns published and in manuscript. He was so full knowledge and charm. My, he liked a fast tempo on a hymn!

    One of his life's missions was to correct the text of the hymn, "O God, Our Help in Ages Past". Erik showed that the original text was "Our God, Our Help, in Ages Past". One of the first hymnals to contain this hymn had a misprint, and it has remained ever since. Erik's hymnal for the Reformed Church in America and the old Pilgrim Hymnal have it right.

    Erik Routley was not interested only in matters sacred music.
    https://pastoffences.wordpress.com/2014/08/18/just-the-facts-erik-routleys-the-puritan-pleasures-of-the-detective-story//a>
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen cesarfranck
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,942
    I am not sure why that would be a correction, given how the next line flows - I get the idea of as an extended single appositive (that is: you (God), our helper, have in ages past been our hope for [the] years [thence] to come), but I am not convinced it's any more correct as an allusion to Psalm 90's meaning than the backward/future metaphor bookended appositives of the more conventional punctuation....

    From 1740 (and Project Gutenberg's transcription of the 1719 original conforms to this for the first line - maybe that's in error, or maybe there was a subsequent correction?): https://hymnary.org/hymn/PDIL1740/page/159
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    Liam, Joseph,

    I'm rather amused at the placement of a comma.

    Consider: "My God I love thee, not
    Because I hope for Heaven thereby"

    and "My God I love thee not,
    Because I hope for Heaven thereby"

    but I'm puzzled why "O God, Our Help, in Ages past,
    Our Hope for Years to come,

    is an improvement over

    "O God, Our Help in Ages Past,
    Our Hope for years to come"

    Thanked by 1Liam
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,942
    Chris

    And I am someone who parses a verse of the English Lord's Prayer as "Thy will be done on earth [slight lift] as it is in Heaven."
  • a_f_hawkins
    Posts: 3,369
    I understood the key point to be the first word, Watts wrote Our and someone ¿Wesley? changed it to O.
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,942
    Aha! If you go through the 159 versions in Hymnary (oldest furthest to the right), you might find about when it happened....
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    Liam,

    That's "IN earth".

    Thanked by 1M. Jackson Osborn
  • a_f_hawkins
    Posts: 3,369
    Let us forgive them that disagree about our current translations.
  • Liam
    Posts: 4,942
    Chris

    I don't worship Anglican or EF, so it's on earth for me, and been that way since I first attended Mass in the mid-1960s (even the 1965 Missal used "on earth").
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,365
    That's "IN earth".
    Yes, Chris, and it's also '...as we forgive THEM that trespass against us...' (And, it's also 'Our Father WHICH art in heaven...')
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    Jackson,

    Yes, I know. I grew up in an Anglican - Episcopal household.

    Thanked by 1M. Jackson Osborn
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    Apropos to nothing, every time I see the title of this thread I read "Smartphone".

    Never the less, an excellent tune.
    Thanked by 1Elmar
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    AND, if I recall correctly the prayer begins with a repetition:

    "Our Father", intoned the Dean.
    "Our Father", replied the assembled congregation.
    "Which art in Heaven", they continued as one voice.
    Thanked by 1M. Jackson Osborn
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,365
    Chris -

    Actually, the celebrant should intone 'Our Father', and everyone else should continue with 'who (which) art in heaven...'; but all too few people know that these days - they just jump in with the celebrant.
    The same goes for the creed - priest says or sings 'I believe in one God' and everyone else continues 'the Father almighty...'
    (And it should be likewise with Gloria, whichever language is used.)

    SO - what does all this have to do with Mr Taylor's nice original hymn tune topic???
    Well, such liturgical laxity is a sharp thorne in all our sides!
    Thanked by 1cesarfranck
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    Jackson,
    It isn't a thorn in my side, for All MY Hope on God is founded.
    Thanked by 1M. Jackson Osborn
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