Good!

I am sure that when the Francis told us, "the reform is irreversible" he was speaking the truth, but perhaps not in the way he intended. We cannot turn back the clock, the reform or deform has taken place, but where are the green shoots the vocations coming from the reform?
For the reform to continue it must have priests willing to use it, it must bring vocations, if it fails to do this and it is obvious that the reform is not very attractive, it will join the other failures that have emanated from the Vatican over the last century.

More vitriol, more diatribes. I'm rather tired of it, and fail to see how it's helpful in any way beyond attempting to stoke the anger stroke the ego of the writers of such articles.

Vilyanor

Who is stoking?.. the furnace of consternation among those who hold to the magesterium and the unchanging truth of the Gospel and the tradition that has been handed down to us?

We cannot be silent or we will be judged complicit by God on the last day.

We do not want to create vitriol. Are the Dubai presented to create vitriol? No, it is for the salvation of souls who could easily be deceived and fall into error and possibly eternal damnation. Our unpleasant warnings could mean the difference for a few or even many souls. And our charge is this: "Go and preach the Gospel to all nations."

We cannot be silent in the face of falsehood or confusion. Let the light of Christ shine out.

>> Does the number of priests you have really matter if Catholics are leaving the church in droves?

my opinion: yes!
From Dom Chautard's, The Soul of the Apostolate:
“If the priest is a saint (the saying goes) the people will be fervent; if the priest is fervent, the people will be pious; if the priest is pious, the people will at least be decent. But if the priest is only decent, the people will be godless. The spiritual generation is always one degree less intense in its life than those who beget it in Christ."

"My Immaculate Heart will triumph"

As far as MIHWT, it is probably not that far away according to the signs of the times. Can YOU read them?

You were all made for this time, this era of great tribulation. Embrace your cross, and walk forward in confidence. The Victory will be that of Jesus and Mary, and the Church will not be defeated. You may suffer martyrdom, but that is a temporal discomfort compared to the glory that awaits us.

lol

Martel, Sobieski, John of Austria......not bad company, CharlesW

St. Margaret

In response to the article by Fr. Z that Francis posted above:

I was at a Marriage in Christ seminar that was put on by my parish. It was the final week, and basically, the entire meeting was a luncheon, where we could all sit and be "communal." The lady I was sitting across from remarked that it was good to see young people such as my wife and me attending parish events and began a discussion of how we could get more young people to get involved. I observed that the first thing to do is get young people going to Mass in the first place. I then pointed out that I see a lot of young people, young couples with families, and children at the TLM. Her jaw couldn't hit the floor hard enough. She was just so flabbergasted that ANYONE would still actually CHOOSE to attend, "that old thing." In the interest of diplomacy, I didn't enumerate the various deficiencies that I perceive in the atmosphere of the NO, particularly at that parish, that may be the cause of the exodus. This is just one of many "reactionary" responses that I have seen not just to the very true statement that young people (20 and 30 somethings as the article defines) are increasingly attending the TLM, but to even the mere suggestion of including anything traditional in the regular parish Masses.

Clerget's experience just above proves that, as or more often than not, unfortunate music regimens are not things thought up or demanded by their 'target' groups, but things that someone else has decided for them that they want, need, desire, or demand. Absent these preposterous folk (who love nothing more than to project their own ignorance onto others), the 'target groups' would likely never have dreamed of what they are said to want, need, desire, or demand.

There is much truth to Charles' point about feminisation. It's fairly predictable that in the average parish, outside of father himself, most or all of the staff will be women. It's bad enough that, to a degree, 'church' or 'religion' has sort of traditionally seemed to be more the concern of women (its 'male dominatedness' notwithstanding): it's even worse now that almost everything in our society is being systematically feminised, including men themselves.

As Heenan so aptly put it, they're smoking outside during mass.

Not anymore, although I do remember having a smoke with father in the late sixties. Glad I don't do that these days.

in light of the new MP, thought you might consider my observant title and the comments... was a couple of weeks early posting this one

perhaps the NO should have an entirely new version of the words of consecration

Isn't that true of all 'reformist' types? They have no love of the institutions which they wish to transform into their own images. Rather than having the honesty to leave and form their own institutions, they connive and burrow like termites into the structures of their target institutions, changing them with patient-but-determined ferocity into what they had never been nor dreamed of being. Finally, after all is said and done, a new generation matures and thinks that the renovated institution as they have experienced it is quite normal and that nothing is wrong.

This happened in the Anglican church, in which the 'reformers' and feministic sexist revolutionaries screeched for decades that 'the Holy Spirit was not being heard' - until after they had accomplished their mission, they then joyfully exuded that 'the Holy Spirit has finally been heard'. For all these types God's will is whatever they happen to desire - they are never wrong and whatever opposes them is not on the side of God and the Holy Spirit. Only they know what God wants, which is, curiously, always identical to what they want.

The same types that have all but destroyed the Anglican church are like termites in the Catholic Church and western universities as well. They know no boundaries and have as their goal the ultimate destruction of Western Civilisation - a goal which they seem perilously close to achieving.
_______________________________________

None of this is new. It is a continuation, an unfolding of the seeds inherent in Renaissance humanism, the Reformation, the French, American, and Russian revolutions, the Enlightenment, world communism such as survives in China, the Pelagianism inherent in the XIX. century social gospel, the relativism of today - all of them events in history which are continuous throughout history. We tend to think that these events and movements are things that have occurred and are over. They are not. Like Christianity itself, they are historical processes locked in a life and death struggle with Western Civilisation and the Church.

...and the way i see it, I believe God will purify His church once again and bring it back to the straight and narrow. It's just another major heresey not unlike the time of the Arian crisis. However, the refinement process, this time, may require a large dose of fire.

Pope Francis is running true to form - creating a mess for his successors to clean up.

Benedictines usually put some effort into liturgy and do it well.

I think you are correct about the liturgy committees. They are often nutty.

I have been to liturgies where feminine priests made the whole liturgy look like a drag show. It wasn't caused by vestments.

Lace was a marker and sign of nobility, since most of the upper church officials in times past were of noble birth. What purpose it serves now, I don't know. It's all mass produced in China and is no longer a sign of wealth or status.