Tozer: "Absolutely valueless and without merit from a musical point of view"
  • "Views from the Choir Loft" has this post:

        A Post About Hymns

    I have not included the proper plain-chant melodies to the translated Breviary hymns, believing them to be unsuitable when sung to words in the vernacular. I have, on the other hand, retained several more or less traditional tunes, absolutely valueless and without merit from a musical point of view, but which seem to have become a necessity if a book is to appeal— as I hope this one will— to the varied needs of various churches.


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  • TCJ
    Posts: 986
    I would like to point out that I've successfully transposed on sight... a couple of times. So, yeah, not so special! I've always wondered how many people could actually do that.
  • I try to make sure that the hymns I play are in a comfortable range for most people. A few hymns I have in different keys because some old pipe organs are not tuned to modern concert pitch.
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  • BruceL
    Posts: 1,072
    Jeff, two thoughts: I would want to listen to Anglican opinions of hymnody from around 1900, NOT Catholic. Remember, this is the "golden age" of RVW and others writing/editing hymns/hymntunes.

    Also, it really says something about the education of organists and pianist in this country that we are not all fairly proficient at transposition-at-sight. No one gets it right the first run through, but everyone should be able to do this after a few minutes of looking/RN analysis. It is just another example of how university training in this country is "flunking out" in practical skills and falling victim to over-specialization.
    Thanked by 2Gavin CHGiffen
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    The Anglicans had similar problems at the turn of the century. I would be curious about the reception of The English Hymnal, and its lack of the popular hymns of the day. If only Tozer had the courage to omit those "valueless" hymns. Even today we have people pimping those hymns out to parishes - on the basis that "it's better than Glory and Praise!"

    No. It really isn't. The old St. Basil's Hymnal (in stark contrast to the New St. Basil's Hymnal) is just another generation's Glory and Praise. And church musicians need to stop pretending that repertoire has any merit to it and consign it to the dustbin of history.

    And I agree completely with Bruce about transposition. If an organist can't do it, he ought to teach himself to do it. Not just to transpose, but also because of the immense aural benefits!
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  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,978
    I can transpose a bit, but not really well. When I was in school, it wasn't considered essential. However, the lack of that skill has gotten me out of playing wretched solos for rotten sopranos more times than I remember.
    Thanked by 2Gavin marajoy
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    Since "Comments are closed" for Jeff's blog article, I supposed comments are in order here. Like, Jeff, I've "been thinking quite a bit about hymns," too, and not just recently, but many years.

    I am so glad that I included a lot of different harmonizations and transpositions for the hymns. There is no “perfect” accompaniment for a hymn. After all, there can be many beautiful and adequate harmonizations.
    Indeed, there are occasionally several beautiful harmonizations for a given tune and, usually more often, quite a few adequate ones; however, I'm not convinced of the necessity of providing a large variety of harmonizations for hymns.

    For one thing, I feel that, generally speaking, alternate harmonization of hymns should be the exception – for special occasions – rather than the rule. It seems to me that congregations are better served through familiarity, not just with the melody but also with the setting (harmonization) of a hymn.

    Second, I would rather see, where appropriate, an alternate hymn tune (always with quality harmonization) supplied for a given hymn text in lieu of alternate harmonization(s) of a fixed tune for that text.

    And third, which is somewhat in keeping with my feelings about providing alternate harmonizations in a hymnal, I think that in some cases, thanks to a brilliant, inspired composer, there can indeed be a "perfect" (or, at least, nearly perfect) setting (harmonization) for that rare hymn (tune) which seems to be truly inspired.

    One such example comes to mind: Come down, O Love divine (Down Ampney). As a (re)harmonizer and composer of hymn tunes, I could not improve on Ralph Vaughan Williams for the harmonization, and my only contribution for this tune has been to provide two soprano descants fitting the original harmonization which – when one is used for the second stanza, the other for the third stanza, and both together for the final stanza – do far more for the elevating the majesty of this hymn at Pentecost than any feeble attempt I might make at providing a new harmonization of such a venerable composition.

    I also feel strongly about tinkering with most of the chorale tune settings by J. S. Bach. More often than not, Bach himself provided alternate settings for the most significant tunes, such as the so-called Passion Chorale (HERZLICH TUT MICH VERLANGEN). In the St. Matthew Passion, among the many chorales Bach uses, this chorale appears five times. The first two settings are the same except for the second being transposed down a semitone (to fit the harmonic flow of the entire work), and they coincide with the one typically found in modern hymnals. The third harmonization (used in The Hymnal 1940), on the text "Befiel du deine Wege," raises the emotional tension (especially in the moving parts at the third line) over the preceeding one. The fourth harmonization, on the text "O Haupt voll Blut und Wunden" (O head full of blood and wounds) that, in translation, is most associated with this tune is the cry of anguishing witnesses to the Crucifixion, but it seems not to have been favored as a hymn setting nowadays. The final harmonization, on the text "Wenn ich soll einmal scheiden," is one of the most poignant expressions of personal sorrow and identification with the loss of our Savior – an exquisite setting, almost completely neglected and yet so appropriate for meditation on the Passion and Suffering of Christ.

    ... in other words, play two verses at a lower key, then improvise into a higher key for the final verse. [emphasis mine]
    I believe the proper terminology is modulate to. Modulation to different keys is an art requiring training, practice, discipline and, yes, improvisation. For example, it doesn't usually suffice, say, to play the final F major of a verse, then a D major 7th chord, and launch into the final verse of a hymn in the key of G major. Moving immediately to the dominant seventh of the target key is generally ill-advised (unless one is truly in a hurry, and then only for moving to certain keys, such as a semitone higher).
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  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    One such example comes to mind: Come down, O Love divine (Down Ampney ). As a (re)harmonizer and composer of hymn tunes, I could not improve on Ralph Vaughan Williams for the harmonization, and my only contribution for this tune has been to provide two soprano descants fitting the original harmonization which – when one is used for the second stanza, the other for the third stanza, and both together for the final stanza – do far more for the elevating the majesty of this hymn at Pentecost than any feeble attempt I might make at providing a new harmonization of such a venerable composition.


    I was unfamiliar with DOWN AMPNEY until fairly recently. (It came up as a suggestion in some Liturgical Planning resource or other). It's a fantastic tune, "Come Down" is an excellent text, and CHG's descants are wonderful.
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen IanW
  • I think this is really cool:

    Charles Giffen multiple harmonizations
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  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    I love this passage from the Foreward to the New St Basil Hymnal (1958)

    Many who have used the St. Basil's Hymnal in the past will look in vain for some of the "good, old hymns." These have been passed over by the Committee because, as has been observed, they are really neither good nor old.


    I chuckle to myself every time I think of this.
  • I remember Msgr. Hellriegel, who was on the committee for the St. Pius X Hymnal, remembering the "Bad church music" of the early 1900's, 1920-30's, which was heavily influenced by the vaudeville and Broadway music of those days. His own Parish Hymnal was made up of Gregorian antiphons and hymns, some of the best of English hymnody and solid German chorales. I assure you his parish "actually participated." At the same time, a parish down the street mouthed the words to "sacred" offerings from one of the popular hymnals of that time. It seems that "the more things change, the more they remain the same."
  • Samuel,

    Can you confirm that Msgr. Hellriegel's parish handed out the LIBER USUALIS at the door, and ushers would watch over people's shoulders to make sure they on the right page?

    This was printed in an article in SACRED MUSIC --- is it true?