St. Edmund Campion Missal & Hymnal for the Traditional Latin Mass * Sent to print 12/24/12
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    Congrats!
    Thanked by 1Paul_Onnonhoaraton
  • No chance to buy through Amazon?
    Thanked by 1Paul_Onnonhoaraton
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,196
    For a low-volume book, the economics are difficult. Here are some rough figures:

    Jacket price: $23
    Trade discount 55%: $12.65
    Bookseller pays publisher: $10.35

    Out of that $10.35, the publisher has to pay the costs to produce the book's content, print the book, and ship it to the bookseller.

    Breaking even on a low-volume book has to be hard in such a scenario.

    Also, if the bookseller doesn't sell them all, the publisher has to accept unsold copies back for a refund. Inevitably some of those copies will no longer be in new condition.

    So if I'm going to buy a book from Watershed, it helps them much more to buy it from their chosen distributor.
  • TCJ
    Posts: 982
    My recommendation: bring more of these hymnals to the next Colloquium than you did V2 hymnals. And have a nice pen or marker handy as well!
  • Ordered mine today -- can't wait to see it. I'm not sure if a book of this beauty has EVER been produced in the English-speaking liturgical world. The older missals are fine and handsome, but they don't have the same exquisite artistry throughout. From what I can tell, this missal will be a premiere instrument for strengthening the faith and identity of traditional Catholics. That is just as important as "knowing what's going on" or having good hymns to sing on the right occasions.
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    This looks like an amazing book. If I attended the EF more often, I'd be buying one right away, and I might have to get one anyway for the occasional times I attend.

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    Thanked by 1Paul_Onnonhoaraton
  • jczarn
    Posts: 65
    As director of a small schola for a weekly EF Mass, I cannot wait for these to be available. The tattered red booklets have been begging for replacement with something of greater dignity. I'm so happy to see the elegance and attention to detail that was put into the Campion Missal - thank you, JMO!

    To those who have ordered, what were the shipping costs? I emailed a request for a quote to Port City this morning, but have not received a response yet. I am planning on ordering a couple copies for evaluation, but I imagine that we will be ordering enough for all of the pews in the near future.
  • jczarn
    Posts: 65
    Just got a reply back from Port City. Looks like a single hymnal would be $22.99 + $5.15 shipping, for a total of $28.14.

    An order of 4 hymnals would be 4*$22.99 + $11.19 shipping, which works out to be just under $26 per hymnal in that case.

    For reference, my shipping address is near Chicago, but I believe media mail shipping is the same price regardless of distance. It certainly will be nicer to have these available on Amazon for smaller orders, but I understand why it must be like this, at least initially.
    Thanked by 1Paul_Onnonhoaraton
  • I am so encouraged by your kind and positive responses.

    I hope all of you will consider reviewing this Book and I can post your reviews on VIEWS FROM THE CHOIR LOFT.

    (Dr. Kwasniewski is a contributor, just FYI).
  • jczarn
    Posts: 65
    Probably a silly question, but will the St. Edmund Campion Missal have hymns in both Latin and English? I understand that there will be hymns that use English translations of the Latin texts, but are the original Latin texts to the hymns included as well?
  • Is there an online listing of what is included in this Hymnal?
  • Seeing that my college takes St Edmund Campion as its Patron, I may be able to arrange for a few copies to be purchased by the chaplaincy for the weekly EF Latin Mass.
  • jczarn
    Posts: 65
    The front table of contents is here:
    http://www.ccwatershed.org/pdfs/7936-foreword-preface-table-contents/download/
    You can see the index of hymns here:
    www.ccwatershed.org/pdfs/7933-latin-mass-hymnal-extraordinary-form-traditional-hymns/download/

    What worries me is that I only see 7 hymns that mention "Latin" by them. Am I interpreting this correctly? Certainly it is wonderful to have quality English texts set to Latin hymns, but our parish currently celebrates a Missa Cantata every Sunday. We typically sing a Latin hymn after the Offertory and Communion chants, so I am hoping I am mistaken.
    Thanked by 1E_A_Fulhorst
  • http://www.ccwatershed.org/media/pdfs/12/12/31/14-14-46_0.pdf

    Here it lists a 20-page section on "Congregational Gregorian Chants." I wonder, though, if that is a complete representation.
  • Friends,

    Thanks again for your interest!

    The complete indices for hymns will be posted at some point. I don't believe it is on the site yet.

    Regarding the musical choices, I think it is important to stress that this book is for the congregation. Many of you probably realize that the 2,000-page Liber Usualis, the 1,500-page Graduale Romanum, and the 1,500-page Antiphonale Romanum are books for the choir. Our book is for the congregation.
  • matthewjmatthewj
    Posts: 2,698
    As far as concern about Latin hymns...

    I tried to avoid them as often as possible. When I first began doing the TLM we would do all sorts of hymns in Latin to common hymn tunes that we'd find... People were able to sing them because they could (kinda) pronounce the words, and they knew the tunes (Winchester New, Diademata, etc)... But, for the most part they didn't know what they were singing. Yes there was a translation printed, but they can't read the translation while singing. They can read a translation while listening, which is why choral motets/anthems in Latin are the way to go. Shorter congregational chants in Latin (Attende Domine, Regina Caeli) are a bit better as people can learn the meaning of the words and remember them. Remembering what every verse of a 6 verse Latin hymn to the tune Diademata means seems rather difficult. The congregation chanting the Ordinary in Latin makes perfect sense because they know what words of the Ordinary parts mean. Unfamiliar Latin hymns with multiple verses to me just seems like killing time.

    My personal opinion is that if someone wants an EF congregation to sing hymns - stick to English hymns done during the procession to the altar before the Asperges and after the Last Gospel. That's more than enough hymns.

    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • matthewj, thanks for the comments!

    Allow me to share with you something a friend told me rather bluntly: "I don't want to hear your congregation try to sing in Latin."

    We do have some selections for the congregation in Latin, but not extremely long or difficult Latin strophic hymns — the choir would sing these. We included all the popular Latin chants: Veni Creator, Attende Domine, etc.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    I've never really given the topic of Latin hymns much thought, but I think that Matthew and Jeff make compelling arguments against them.

    I think there's "easy Latin" and "hard Latin". Parce Domine is easy - not too many words, and mostly familiar. The verses of Attende Domine are hard - lots of words, many of which do not regularly appear elsewhere in the Mass. I can see that one would want to be cautious as to which Latin hymns one would choose for a congregation.
  • We put all the well known simple congregational chants in the Campion Missal, but the congregation only sings the "Attende Domine" Refrain, and choir sings the verses.
    Thanked by 1Gavin
  • Hmm, I think I'll wait until the St. John Fisher missal is published...
  • DanielCDanielC
    Posts: 37
    I won't!! Wow, this is exactly what I was looking for... Beautiful, and chock-full of what I like most in a pew missal. I'm certainly getting a couple!
  • jczarn
    Posts: 65
    I'm not waiting either! Already ordered 4 copies for evaluation, but I'm expecting that I will fall in love with it and try to get copies ordered for all of the pews.

    I was told my order would be shipped in late January or early February... I'm hoping it's sooner rather than later.

    Anyway, is there even any suggestion that the St. John Fisher Missal will be published anytime in the near future? It is a nice resource to be sure, but it doesn't even seem to be in the same league as the Campion Missal/Hymnal with respect to completeness and polish.
    Thanked by 1Paul_Onnonhoaraton
  • JahazaJahaza
    Posts: 470
    Was the complete list of hymns ever published?
    Thanked by 1Joseph Mendes