Interesting question. I have no citations but surely physical proximity plays into it. How would it done if the schola is in the rear loft?

For what it's worth, at St. Paul's in Cambridge at the 11 a.m. solemn OF Mass those serving in the sanctuary receive the incensing first, then the schola (seated to the right of the altar), and then the congregation.

"Can someone explain to me why lay servers are incensed and not lay Scholas, even when both are equally clerical functions?"

I admit this is a source of some confusion, and I think proximity to the sanctuary "choir" (collection of clerics not directly involved in the Mass being celebrated)does incline some scholas to accept (expect) incensation on a par with servers. (This has happened only once in my experience, at an FSSP Mass, when the schola sat behind the choir. The next time, we were moved a discrete distance from the choir, probably to avoid just such confusion.)

But I think your premise is essentially mistaken. Neither is a clerical function per se, otherwise we would be called clerics. Nor do I think the schola fulfills the same sort of liturgical function as the servers, whose various roles are spelled out in the rubrics, and who serve more directly in the sanctuary (rather than just being near by). Myself, I am quite satisfied to get my incense along with the congregation.

Only if the priest demands that they sing "On Eagles' Wings". (sorry, couldn't resist). No need to add a real answer to what's been said.

It's about as bad an idea as putting lilies by the schola.

Regarding pseudo-clerical vs. congregational, although a dreadful rabbit hole, I found this audio interesting.

Richard R.

We are not speaking of simply providing choral pieces for the Mass. Rather I am speaking of the liturgical propers, and not motets or even the Ordinary of the Mass, the latter being traditionally a congregational role. If you could point out where Pius XII permits women to sing the liturgical propers of the Mass, I'd very much appreciate it. With the rare exception of nuns within their convents, men assume the role exclusively of chanting the liturgical propers.

... and yes, the clerical character of a liturgical schola is not a subject found in the realm of opinions.

Arthur Connick,

I see no contradiction in Pope Pius XII's directives. Polyphony most certainly does not necessitate the use of women. Here Pius XII reaffirms the role of a liturgical schola as being proper to the those entered into the clerical state:

"93. A - Clerics present at a liturgical ceremony in the manner, and form prescribed by the rubrics, who fulfill the role of sacred or minor ministers or sing in the choir or schola cantorum, exercise a liturgical ministry which is direct, and proper to them by virtue of their ordination or elevation to the clerical state."

Here he makes mention of this role being a function to be carried out by men whenever possible:

"93. C - Therefore, laity of the male sex, whether boys, young men, or adults, when appointed by competent ecclesiastical authority to serve at the altar or to perform the sacred music, and when they fulfill this office in the manner, and form prescribed by the rubrics, exercise a liturgical ministry which is direct, though delegated. If they are singers, they must be a part of the choir or schola cantorum."

Lastly, the admittance of women into a choir is done out of necessity and, when this is done, they are not be located in the sanctuary, i.e. the proper location of the liturgical choir.

"100. Wherever such a choir cannot be organized, a choir of the faithful, either mixed or consisting only of women or girls, can be permitted. But such a choir should take its place outside the sanctuary or Communion rail. The men should be separated from the women or girls so that anything unbecoming may be avoided."

Hello, Mr. Connick. I understand your train of thought, but I think you're approaching the subject backwards. A liturgical schola assumes a clerical character not by virtue of its place within the sanctuary, but by virtue of its function. This function is not altered in any way by simply a change of location within the body of the Church. The U.S. is fairly unique in that its churches, even those spared the iconoclastic fury of the mid 20th century, are utterly devoid of a proper "choir". In addition, the practice of having a liturgical schola in the choir loft has been in vogue since at least the 18th century. I see no reason as to why we are to assume St. Pius X was ignorant of this ubiquitous practice when he issued his Motu Proprio in 1903 (which makes no distinction between a schola in a loft or in the sanctuary.) Regardless, a choir situated in a choir within the sanctuary is a rubrical manifestation of the schola's clerical character, but not its cause.

Hello, Ms. Wilson. The preceding posts of this thread answer your comments in their entirety. The roles of serving at the altar and being part of a liturgical schola are inherently clerical *functions*. The perennial practice of the Church and the documents of Pope St. Pius X and Pius XII are abundantly clear on this fact.

In regard to the rubrics pertaining to incensations, as you know, the altar-boys (fulfilling the clerical role of an ordained Acolyte) are indeed incensed individually. Secondly, as the preceding posts illuminate, a schola *is* incensed when they are situated with their proper place in the sanctuary. However, when they are detached from this proper location, the ceremonial proper to them is omitted. However, the schola's function (a clerical one) remains the same and, hence, these men are to be vested for this function in cassock and surplice in the same manner as an altar-boy.

Torquemada, I just opened O'Connell (1964). Not sure what part you're referring to. Anyone below the rank of priest assisting in choir (regardless of role) is incensed collectively in smaller churches (III, IV, IX, 11e, p. 428, see also 2d, p. 425). This means laymen are to be incensed collectively along with seminarists sitting in choir, whether ordained to the diaconate or subdiaconate or minor orders or tonsured (and thus clergy under the canon law of the time) or not. It is assumed that among those in choir may be those actually engaged in singing (III, VII, I, 7, p. 450, see also ff21).

It would be odd for someone in choir not to be incensed, because they would be the only people at Mass not incensed. The congregation is incensed immediately after. If the schola were situated somewhere in the sanctuary apart from the rest of the choir, it would make sense for the schola to be incensed collectively and separately, just as lay servers sitting on both sides of the sanctuary, or squeezed into odd nooks and crannies, are incensed separately from each other (even though O'Connell does not indicate this).

But the rules for incensing a schola sitting out of place should be the same as for other servers and clergy sitting out of place. Why would this happen? Principally because of lack of seating in a small church, or some other practical or charitable consideration (think, wheelchair). What would probably be done? I've only seen this a couple of times, but I believe priests might get a special swing of the incense if they are sitting in the front pews, and otherwise everyone (deacon and below) would be incensed along with the congregation. If they fill up the whole front pew, though, they might get special swings.

In all the many times I've sung vested in the loft, I've never once received a special swing of the incense, even when singing with vested priests. And even if I did, I don't think anyone would have noticed, because it's not like the thurible has precise aim at 250 feet.

IMO, the big difference between a "clerical" and "congregational" role for laymen at Mass is expectation of behavior.

Hello, Mrs. Wilson. No, of course I meant no offense in referring to you as "Ms.". If I am unaware of a lady's marital status, "Ms." is the default.

Yes, upon closer examination and in discussing the issue with several traditional Priests, the rubrics indicate that a schola situated within their proper place (in the sanctuary) is to be incensed. When they are detached from their proper place in the sanctuary, the ceremonial pertaining to a liturgical schola is omitted.

But it does seem to go against the Fortescue passage you mentioned, which clearly excludes men who aren't clerics.

When you get deep into such a particular rubrical question, you will sometimes find that there is a not a specific "correct" answer. The rules for incensing the choir and others at the offertory is a particularly confusing area. The opinions of the approved authors may vary. In the past, you would solve such a problem by submitting a dubium to the Sacred Congregation of Rites. For various reasons, that's not much done today. One should follow the approved authors and local custom.