propers for Mary, Queen of Heaven?
  • Richard MixRichard Mix
    Posts: 2,397
    The diocese of Oakland will observe the Queenship of Mary instead of OT 21 this August 22, and I'm trying to work out what will be needed/may be used. According to Masses for the BVM (vol. I p220; vol. II p129) I can expect:

    Introit Ps.45:10 The queen stands at your right hand arrayed in cloth of gold.

    Lesson Isa.9:1-3,5-6 The people that walked in darkness...
    or Zech.9:9-10 Rejoice greatly...

    Psalm 45:11-2,14-18 Listen to me, daughter; see and bend your ear.

    Epistle Cor.15:20-26 Christ rising...the first fruits...

    Acclaimation Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you; blessed are you among women.

    Gospel Lk.1:26-38

    Comm. Lk.1:45 Blessed are you for firmly believing that the promises of the Lord would be fulfilled.

    The gradual at least is recognizable as Audi filia, as I would expect on the octave of the Assumption, but is the given introit a verse to replace eructavit? What of the communion?

    It also surprises me to see the epistle repeating from the previous Sunday...
  • dvalerio
    Posts: 341
    > The gradual at least is recognizable as Audi filia

    Yes, but do you say this because you plan to use Gregorian chant? If so, the chants indicated in the Graduale Romanum or the Graduale Simplex take precedence over what the Missale Romanum or the Lectionary prescribe. In any case, the Alleluia is «Ave Maria», GR1974 p. 412; the Communion corresponds to an Office antiphon, «Beata es Maria quae credidisti», AR1912 p. 205; the Introit corresponds to an Offertory, «Filiae regum», GR1974 p. 505 (the OF of the Mass recycles Offertories as Introits not a few times) and an Office antiphon (which I can't seem to find anywhere right now, but is listed by Hesbert).
  • Richard,
    I asked my pastor today, after checking the 2010 Ordo, according to which, the Feast will not be observed on Sunday
    the 22nd this year: perhaps because we will have just celebrated the Solemnity of the Assumption the previous Sunday.
    Father Keyes was going to double check with the Bishop this evening. I'll update you as I learn more.
  • eft94530eft94530
    Posts: 1,576
    For the OF ...

    General Norms for the Liturgical Year
    Table of Liturgical Days (TLD)

    2010-aug-08 OT-19 (TLD 6)
    2010-aug-15 OT-20 (TLD 6)
    2010-aug-22 OT-21 (TLD 6)
    2010-aug-29 OT-22 (TLD 6)

    Aug 15 Assumption (Solemnity) (see TLD 3)
    Assumption has precedence over OT-20

    Aug 22 Queenship of Mary (Memorial) (see TLD 10)
    Queenship is ignored
    ... HOWEVER ...
    according to Diocese of Oakland Directory (page 1 col 2):
    Primary Patroness: Our Lady, Queen of the World, August 22
    which promotes it to Solemnity for Oakland Diocese
    Queenship has precedence over OT-21

    Where is the logic flawed?

    The last time this situation occurred (falling on Sunday) was in August 2004.
    The parish email archive does not go back that far to enable a re-visit of any Diocesan communications.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 8,730
    The same logic might apply in Montreal, where the cathedral's patronage is Marie, Reine du monde.
  • Richard MixRichard Mix
    Posts: 2,397
    Thanks Duarte. We do two cantor masses with psalmtone propers in English. At one, Communion is in Latin with translation chanted as a verse, and English offertories from various sources using Gregorian melodies are being phased in, but Gloria patri VII is so well sung by the congregation I'm hesitant about messing with introits. A third choral mass has processional hymn, an apt offertory anthem, and Latin+English communion antiphon while choir receives. So yes, we use some gregorian chant, but I also consult the propers along with the lectionary when choosing polyphony.

    I think the local situation is as my good friend eft94530 (not to blow his incognito) describes, but he has taught me to check for last minute course corrections (will Epiphany be transfered this year? Wait for the ordo in late Dec...) so I'd be interested in what Samuel finds out- provided that we are close neighbors, that is.
  • dvalerio
    Posts: 341
    That would be Recordare Virgo Mater. Actually, according to the 1974 Graduale Romanum, the propers are as follows:

    Introit - Salve Sancta Parens [or] Vultum tuum deprecabuntur
    Gradual - Posuisti Domine
    Alleluia - Posuisti Domine
    Offertory - Recordare Virgo Mater
    Communion - Diffusa est gratia

    All the chants above, save the Gradual, can be found in the 1961 Graduale Romanum available at You can also use common chants for the Blessed Virgin.
  • dvalerio
    Posts: 341
    > English offertories from various sources using Gregorian melodies are being phased in

    If this is the case you may want to check the Plainchant Gradual (also found at, vols. 3-4, page 209* (I don't suppose it's a good adaptation, but that's what you have; neither the Anglican Use Gradual nor the American Gradual have this Offertory, as far as I can see).
  • Richard MixRichard Mix
    Posts: 2,397
    Many thanks, especially for the page number! I cant find an index to The Plainchant Gradual but suppose one can work backwards from GR... I dont think it's all that bad, actually, as to singability at sight. The American Gradual is the one that really keeps me busy with tweaking during the sermon.
  • dvalerio
    Posts: 341
    Well, this particular Offertory has a link just for itself in the PDF file from, so it was really easy for me to find it... :)
  • Richard MixRichard Mix
    Posts: 2,397
    It's that time of the decade again ;-) Any news yet eft?
    In the meantime a start has been made on The Plainchant Gradual index, which anyone is welcome to continue.