taking communion twice in one day?
  • JamJam
    Posts: 636
    So, most of you guys know I am Eastern Orthodox. I have a question about Catholic praxis. One of my roommates is required to go to two Masses -- certain groups on campus ask people to go to certain Masses on certain days, and she happens to be in two groups that are asking her to go to two Masses on the same day. I found out that she's planning on taking communion at both.

    So, twice in one day? Is that okay? She said it wouldn't if she were going twice "just for the heck of it," but because she is required to be at both, she should. Now, of course I don't understand this. In the Orthodox world we don't have this concept that you should take communion every single time it is offered to you. It is good for your soul to receive regularly, of course, but "regularly" for us is once a week, and twice a week during Lent. Twice in one day seems really excessive to me. Surely if you already have the Body and Blood of Christ coursing through your veins you don't need "more"?

    I know in the West that it is okay to receive communion at a wedding or a funeral even if you had already been to Mass that day, and that makes a little more sense. But two daily Masses?
  • RagueneauRagueneau
    Posts: 2,592
    My understanding is that Pope John Paul II has changed the norms --- if one assists at both Masses, one can receive Holy Communion at both Masses.

    The norms for Holy Communion have changed a lot over the centuries. There used to be a Pope in the Middle Ages who would say Mass nine times in one day.

    Again, as far as Catholics go, we just follow whatever legislation the Church gives us.

    I think priests can say more Masses under different circumstances, as well. In case of necessity, as well as Christmas day and Nov. 2nd.
  • JamJam
    Posts: 636
    I understand the bit about priests. That makes sense, since there are so many huge parishes with, like, two priests to serve everyone.

    What is "assisting" at Mass...? Just being there and praying, or is it having some kind of extra liturgical function?

    and what reason did JPII have had to change that norm...? Like, do you know the reasoning behind it?
  • Carl DCarl D
    Posts: 992
    I've also been semi-reliably informed that receiving twice is fine when you're fully engaged with the Mass. Popping in for a quick Communion on the way to something else probably wouldn't qualify.

    The logic of "body and blood coursing through your veins" doesn't seem to give you any conclusion. If you "need" it once a day, why not once an hour? If once a day is "good enough", then why not once a week, once a year, or once a lifetime? All these distinctions are so artificial anyway. God is outside time, so He probably just laughs at all this anyway.

    We need what we need to help us stay close to God. The Church tries to help us do that, but by necessity it's based on millions of people.
  • JamJam
    Posts: 636
    At some point, though, you have to stop feeding yourself and start feeding other people. "Go in peace -- in the name of the Lord" and all that, right?
  • Kathy
    Posts: 5,510
    What is the problem, exactly?
  • JamJam
    Posts: 636
    I think the problem is that I annoyed my roommate for no reason other than ignorance. :/
  • Canon law specifies the regulations for how often one may receive communion:

    Canon 917: "A person who has already received the Most Holy Eucharist can receive it a second time on the same day only within the eucharistic celebration in which the person participates, without prejudice to the prescript of can. 921, §2."

    This is codified to allow for cases when one might receive communion outside of mass (in the hospital, in hospice care, etc.), but later is able to attend a mass; canon 917 gives them permission to receive communion a second time when it is at a Mass. One is not allowed to receive communion twice when the second time is not in the context of a Mass. Canon 921 speaks of receiving Viaticum--in danger of death the law is relaxed and you are allowed to receive communion possibly a third time... [Edited: Hmmm, three times...not sure really if canon law envisions this and I haven't yet run across this as a priest either. Maybe a canon lawyer can comment!]

    It is a relevant question for the forum though, since more than a few here might sing or serve at multiple Masses on Sunday.
  • Jam, "assist" means "attend". Latin roots are approximately "stand near" for assist and "stretch toward" for attend. In Spanish atender has as primary meaning "pay attention". Asistir means "be present", especially in a helping capacity. I suspect the other romance languages would be very close to this. In Latin assistere/adsistere has stand near as the primary meaning. In English the meanings have shifted. But I have noted that many devotional booklets etc still use assist in its older meaning.
  • Hmmm. I'm in the situation Fr. Spencer mentions: I often attend two or more Masses in a single day as part of my musical responsibilities. I know one person who, trying to make rent, plays for 6 Masses per weekend. Neither he nor I have ever received communion at more than one Mass on a given day, though we have received at both a Saturday vigil and a Sunday morning, which liturgically is the same day. In your roommate's position, we would probably choose one Mass at which to receive.

    But, if he or she decided to do otherwise, with healthy intensions, I don't see that it's feeding oneself in opposition to serving others. Unending, non-sacramentally mediated unity with the Lord is, after all, the goal of this entire project.

    I'd find it odd if a particular person felt they -needed- to receive communion multiple times daily, except in the most extreme of circumstances such as danger of death. But, if they did feel that way, I wouldn't find reason to forbid it as harmful. A priest might be able to help the person find enough of a sense of stability and peace that they would no longer feel the need, but who knows? I would hesitate to find fault, in the absence of some clearly warped motive or consequences. I think this is above my pay grade.
  • OlbashOlbash
    Posts: 314
    It seems that receiving a maximum of once per day is the intended norm, and that there ought to be good reason to stray from this norm.

    In the case of the organist who plays six Masses on Sunday, it might be unnecessarily scandalous to receive communion only once at the same Mass each Sunday. The faithful at the other five Masses might presume that the organist was not Catholic, persisting in grave sin, or what have you. Of course, the faithful should not be keeping scorecards about who receives the Sacrament; but, a Catholic organist ought to give at least some consideration to the outward sign of his sacramental unity with the communities he serves.
  • JamJam
    Posts: 636
    I don't notice whether musicians receive or not unless they're placed in the sanctuary, where I can't help but notice them.

    Nevertheless, canon law allows for people to receive TWICE in one day max... not six times. So that organist would be outta luck at four masses anyway.

    I'm wondering at the reasoning behind the rules. Why only once or twice a day? Why did it change from once to twice for laypeople and not just priests (whose reception of communion is in the rubrics)?

    The East doesn't have a tradition of daily Mass, either, except in a few rare instances (usually resulting from Western influence), so even once a day is not the norm for the whole [sacramental] Christian world. Why are norms what they are? What did they used to be, what are they now, what might they be in the future? That's the kind of stuff I'm curious about.
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    So Jam, people don't go to daily Mass in Eastern rite? Then how about the priests? Do they celebrate daily Mass? I'm very interested in this, because I've been thinking about the importance of more spiritual communion lately in daily Mass.
  • Here is a minimally detailed answer from CUF. Too minimal to be truly satisfying, but still, it's something.

    According to Dom Dix in The Shape of the Liturgy, the Eucharist was first celebrated with bishops and priests concelebrating, or "corporately." The Eucharist was not normally celebrated daily in pre-Nicene times. During Augustine’s time (c. 400), daily Eucharist was introduced in Africa, but the rest of the Church simply observed the feast days on the calendar. As more feast days were added to the calendar, the Church moved gradually closer to daily Eucharist. Where there was daily liturgy in the fifth century, it was celebrated with the bishop. Daily Eucharist in some regions in the fifth and sixth centuries was tied to the bishop’s devotion to the Eucharist. Therefore, the largest leap to widespread daily Eucharist was the assignment of priests to parishes. Priests who wanted to exercise more fully their priesthood began to celebrate the Eucharist daily.

    According to Dix, the Eucharist was not celebrated daily on a regional basis until the seventh century. At this time the practice became widespread in Frankish monasteries and many of the secular priests of large rural dioceses were dispatched by their bishops for parish work. While daily Mass eventually became usual for all regions of the Western Church, to this day Eastern Catholics celebrate according to the liturgical calendar.

    1 Dom Gregory Dix, The Shape of the Liturgy (London: A & C Black ©1945) 592-593. Includes note: "A useful collection of the early evidence on daily celebration is found in Sacrificial Priesthood by Fr. Joseph Barker, C.R., London, 1941."
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,983
    I used to say jokingly that Latins go bad very fast if they don't receive communion every day. ;-) Of course, I am not serious about that. I suspect the east is closer to apostolic practice in priests being able to say, at most, one liturgy per day on an altar that can only be used once per day. But let's face it, our services are so long that daily celebration isn't practical. To be sure, there are cultural differences at play, too. My only concern with such frequent communion in the west, is that familiarity does often lead to contempt. It seems in many places that it has led to exactly that.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,217
    The permission started small and was extended over time. At some point permission was granted for Easter and Christmas, for faithful to receive the Sacrament again at a second Mass in the day after having already received at the Easter Vigil or the Christmas midnight Mass.

    In 1967 (in the document Eucharisticum Mysterium) permission was granted for faithful who had received on Saturday morning, and then at an evening vigil Mass. Also there was permission for the two Holy Thursday Masses.

    In 1973 (in the document Immensae caritatis) the permission was extended for faithful at weddings, baptisms, confirmations, funerals, professions, and other ritual Masses; at first Masses of religious congresses, parish missions, and various other cases; and for Viaticum, and for any one-time case the Bishop allowed.

    This was getting uselessly complicated, and the rule was eventually changed, so that the permission applied to any Mass. (I wish I could cite a document for this: there should be one from the CDW.) There might have been some condition attached about attending the whole Mass, but maybe I was misunderstanding something.

    Fr. Spencer's quote from the Code, above, gives the current state of things.
  • Chrism
    Posts: 872
    The gloss on canon 917 in MTF's Code of Canon Law Annotated (2d ed.):

    The possibility of receiving communion a second time in the same day (cf. Immensae caritatis 2 [omit cite]) can only exist within the Mass, since the reasons that justify this are found precisely in the circumstances that characterize this celebration (for example: the fulfillment of the Sunday obligation on the previous evening, evening Mass on Holy Thursday, the second Mass on Easter, ritual Masses, funerals, etc.) The case in which there is danger of death is omitted, as it is addressed directly in c. 921.


    The gloss on canon 921 (regarding Viaticum) doesn't address the "3rd time" question, so I assume that this is permitted.
  • JamJam
    Posts: 636
    So Jam, people don't go to daily Mass in Eastern rite? Then how about the priests? Do they celebrate daily Mass? I'm very interested in this, because I've been thinking about the importance of more spiritual communion lately in daily Mass.


    That is correct. Liturgy is only on Sundays and feast days, and during Lent there is liturgy on Sundays and presanctified on Wednesday evenings (and in more hardcore places, Friday morning also). Some monasteries will have Divine Liturgy three days a week or so, I don't know if they choose feast days during the week to celebrate for that or if they just decide what days of the week to have Divine Liturgy on. There are some places in Russia which have a tradition of daily Divine Liturgy but I don't know much about it, and I think it came about due to Western influence.

    Ideally Divine Liturgy is for Sundays, and then the Divine Office is for weekdays. So you would have morning, noon, evening, and night prayers daily rather than Liturgy, which is for Sunday. Like Rebecca posted above, this more closely follows the ancient pattern. Only monasteries celebrate all the hours, but there are some parishes with daily or midweek Vespers. And of course rather than a vigil mass on Saturday evening, most Orthodox parishes celebrate Great Vespers instead. Great Vespers (what you would call Sunday Vespers one) is considered preparation for Sunday Matins, which is preparation for the Eucharist, and there are some priests who strongly prefer people to attend Great Vespers and Matins if they are to receive communion.

    As for priests, in the East they are not allowed to celebrate the Eucharist by themselves--they need at least a reader in order to licitly celebrate, but the ideal is of course their whole parish.

    The sensibility that communion should only be received a few times a year, or within three days of confession, still lingers in a good part of Orthodoxy. In order to receive one must fast from midnight the night before (or for an evening liturgy, sometime before noon), pray certain preparatory prayers, be properly disposed, have been to confession recently (how recently depends on your spiritual father), etc. etc. I mean, I don't mean to make it sound formulaic, because it isn't, but the attitude toward communion is such that a daily or twice daily reception doesn't... make sense. Unless you're living like a monk, and can afford to do all that fasting and praying!
  • Chrism
    Posts: 872
    Jam,

    The ideal Western praxis in the first part of the 20th Century seems to have been Confession every week, Mass and Communion every morning, strict fast from Midnight until some time after Communion, daily Rosary, morning and night prayers.