Bp. Trautman Discussing new LOTH translation TODAY
  • ossian1898ossian1898
    Posts: 142
    I saw this come across the RomanBreviary Yahoo group yesterday. I didn't realize the date was for TODAY.

    WHAT:
    Most Rev. Donald W. Trautman to Give Third Annual Frederick R. McManus Memorial Lecture at CUA

    WHEN:
    4 p.m., Thursday, Oct. 22

    WHERE:

    The Catholic University of America
    Caldwell Auditorium
    620 Michigan Ave., N.E.
    Washington, D.C.

    DETAILS:
    Most Rev. Donald W. Trautman, bishop of the Diocese of Erie, Pa., will deliver the third annual Frederick R. McManus Memorial Lecture in a presentation titled The Language of the New Missal in Light of the Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy.

    Bishop Trautman, an authority on Catholic liturgy and scripture, has served as chairman of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops' liturgy and doctrine committees. Before being named bishop of Erie in 1990, he served as chancellor, vicar general, auxiliary bishop and pastor in the Diocese of Buffalo, N.Y.

    The lecture honors Monsignor McManus, the late CUA professor and expert on liturgy. A CUA alumnus, he joined the faculty in 1958 and served in varying roles, including as dean of the School of Canon Law and as vice provost and dean of graduate studies. He initiated a graduate program in liturgical studies during his tenure. After retiring in 1993, he continued to teach as a professor emeritus until 1997. He died in 2005.

    For more information, contact the School of Canon Law at 202-
    319-5492 or cua-canonlaw@cua.edu.

    SPONSOR:
    School of Canon Law

    MEDIA:

    To cover the lecture, contact Katie Lee or Mary McCarthy in the Office of Public Affairs at 202-319-5600.
  • don roy
    Posts: 306
    anyone know anything about this?
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,611
    “The (Second Vatican Council’s) Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy stipulated vernacular language, not sacred language,” he added. “Did Jesus ever speak to the people of his day in words beyond their comprehension? Did Jesus ever use terms or expressions beyond his hearer’s understanding?”

    http://www.catholicreview.org/subpages/selectedstory.aspx?action=7065
  • francis
    Posts: 10,848
    Slavishly accurate is the correct term for the translation not slavishly literal.
  • priorstf
    Posts: 460
    What does "stipulated" mean? Or "vernacular"? He should stop showing off, the bleeding sesquipedalian.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,220
    Well, it fits. There's a story around about how he received petitioners for a Latin Mass into his office and spoke Latin to them.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    His arguments hold up if the Mass is directed at the congregation. Of course it isn't, so they don't.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,220
    By the way, did he say anything about the Liturgy of the Hours translation, or is the thread title a mistake?
  • don roy
    Posts: 306
    by the way, check out troutmans cathedral . it is suprisingly lovely anfd relatively unwreckovated (although the tour description in the websight is rather interesting).
    i cant help but think that somewhere, deep down he knows better but for some reason cant face the "new reality" (that the Mass isnt about "us' anymore) his arguments now seem so trite, disengenuios and just a little silly.
  • Steve CollinsSteve Collins
    Posts: 1,022
    I just read parts of his address. It's still the same old, tired story from him. Our people are just to simple to understand any large words, etc. (Of course that might be because most parochial schools are merely private schools for parents to avoid the public school system - the lesser of two evils, so to speak.) So, let Johnny Depp and Walt Disney have the good English in the pirate movies, and give us adult Catholics all the 6th grade language. (Or is it 4th grade language by now. Just how would you evaluate it with education today?)
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,220
    by the way, check out troutmans cathedral . it is suprisingly lovely anfd relatively unwreckovated

    The economic decline of a city can be good for the preservation of its churches. :-)
  • Maureen
    Posts: 679
    "Did Jesus ever use terms or expressions beyond his hearer’s understanding?"

    Oh, c'mon. What a gimme.

    Kid Jesus, in Luke 2:50 -- "But they did not understand what he was saying to them."

    Luke 9:45 -- "But they did not understand this statement, and it was concealed from them so that they would not perceive it; and they were afraid to ask Him about this statement."

    Luke 18:34 -- "But the disciples did not understand any of these things. Its meaning was hidden from them, and they did not know what he was talking about."

    Mark 9:32 -- "But they did not understand his saying, and they were afraid to ask him."
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    Most everything Jesus said astonished people and none of it entirely made sense until after the Resurrection. I'm thinking now of the scene after the Transfiguration. No one understood what was happening. His explanation was even more confusing.
  • don roy
    Posts: 306
    yunno jeffry, your last comment is actually pretty remarkable and really shows how far we've come in a suprisingly short amount of time.
    think about it, what troutman said was just the standared line not too long ago and would have been met with nothing more than polite nods of approval. now the tired condescending old saw can be seen for what it always was...fundamentally and fatally flawed. as you said "most everything he said astonished people".
    troutmann is so unhip so status quo so out of touch so non contemporary so....so.....conservative!!!!

    dontcha love it!!!?
  • Dan F.Dan F.
    Posts: 205
    Maureen, nice!
  • francis
    Posts: 10,848
    Jesus: "Unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you will not have life within you."
    Disciples: "Are you out of your mind?"

    At which point most of his disciples left him for good.
  • don roy
    Posts: 306
    most likely I did something stupid (being the computor-a-ly challanged person that I am) but I could have sworn i had a comment right after jeffries.
    Did I do something wrong?
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    No, not at all, Don. It's just that I thought my own comment was unclear and that you had responded to that, so I changed my comment and then gave you an opportunity to comment again. I was going to drop you an email but then didn't. Sorry about that!
  • Steve CollinsSteve Collins
    Posts: 1,022
    Here is what is becoming clearer to me - what our bishops actually think about all of us PIPs, the sheep of their flock:

    Either we are all to stupid (except for a handful of elite musicians, who are a pain to deal with) to learn any Latin to worship our God; or we, as Americans all, are far to important, too "special", to simply to the bidding of Rome, a totally antiquated place, on a continent Americans' ancestors fled from in droves over the last few centuries.

    Which is it? Are we too stupid, or are we just too good? The bishops cannot have it both ways. And I am personally offended by either attitude from them.
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    Someone commented that Americans are very independet people, and the country started that way. So even with this short tradition, it's kind of hard for most Americans to follow the hierachical system of the Church?
  • Steve CollinsSteve Collins
    Posts: 1,022
    And after all the trouble the Catholic Church in the USA went through in creating the Baltimore Catechism, to help teach Catholics how to be good US citizens without fear of corrupting their spiritual life. After putting up with the persecution from the "know nothings" in the 19th century. Now, American Catholics are above their Church? What outright arrogance!
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