O Redeemer… and its retired cousins?
  • Palestrina
    Posts: 508
    It has occurred to me that the O Redeemer is as striking and unusual as a piece of Offertory music as ‘Draw nigh and take’ is at Communion (the latter seemingly the only ancient example of a communion hymn associated with the actual reception of the Sacrament).

    Does anyone know whether O Redeemer has any long-retired liturgical ‘cousins’, as it were? The Offertory procession of the Chrism Mass is striking now but I wonder whether there were other similar pieces for similar use at other times in the liturgical year… in any of the Western liturgies.
  • Palestrina
    Posts: 508
    A possibly related question…

    There seems to be a small repertoire of verse and chorus Gregorian pieces - think O Filii, O Redemptor, Ubi Caritas.

    It’s hardly surprising they fell out of use given the Tridentine reforms (Dobszay’s reminder that the Roman Rite is bigger than its settled Tridentine edition is helpful)… They’re not ‘conventional’ there.

    Any ideas for where to find original sources?
  • Palestrina
    Posts: 508
    There’s also that amazing Introit of Easter Sunday as in the Graduale Simplex…
  • MatthewRoth
    Posts: 3,223
    The Ubi Caritas has its place on Holy Thursday during the Mandatum though. It’s not a devotional or pious chant, and go figure, it’s now the one piece that we associate with that rite, to the point of not doing the other antiphons (some of which don’t get used again either).

    But I also don’t see how something like O Filii et Filiae (or since it’s almost Christmas, Puer natus in Bethlehem) are more liturgical in another context besides that of the received Roman rite: the chants of other rites are more varied but tend to be on the same model as the Roman usage (antiphons, responsories, office hymns, etc.), and then that leaves communion (I don’t even know if William Renwick has a good idea of what music was sung or even played during communion, but that’s where these pieces fit well in our day due to their length).
  • Palestrina
    Posts: 508
    Apropos of the Easter Sunday Introit in the Simplex, I see that the Norbertine Processionale has this piece in the appendix, ascribed to Solesmes… so perhaps a 19th-century invention. I thought that Cardine had only used authentic repertoire in compiling the Simplex, however, so this may be a misattribution.
  • RoborgelmeisterRoborgelmeister
    Posts: 313
    Paul Ford wrote this about the East Sunday Introit in the Simplex (and in his version, By Flowing Waters).
    Alleluia, This Is the Day (Mode V)
    BFW 148; LCR 48
    This gathering song for Easter Sunday began life as three ancient antiphons sung at the night office of the Liturgy of the Hours in the Easter season (verses 2, 4, and 5). Verses 6, 7, and 8 are borrowed from the Easter sequence, Victimae Paschali Laudes (as “Christians, Praise the Paschal Victim”. Verse 1 is the versicle and response, and verse 9 the short responsory, of all the offices of Easter week; verse 3 is the first part of the gospel canticle antiphon for Easter Thursday evening prayer. Single and double alleluias highlight the joy of the Easter event.
    1 This is the day the Lord has made, let us rejoice and be glad. (Psalm 118:24)
    2 The stone has been rolled away from the door of the tomb. (cf. John 20:1)
    3 They have taken away my Lord, and I know not where they have laid him. (cf. John 20:2)
    4 Mary, why do you seek the living Christ among the dead? (cf. Luke 24:5)
    5 Mary, do not weep; The Lord has risen again. (cf. John 20:13 and Matthew 16:7)
    6 He who hung upon the cross has risen from the grave. (cf. Matthew 28:5–6)
    7 Tell us, Mary, what did you see on your way? (cf. John 20:15)
    8 I saw two angels robed in white, and I saw the shroud. (cf. John 20:12 and 20:7)
    9 Christ my hope has risen; he goes before you into Galilee. (cf. Matthew 28:7 and Mark
    16:7)
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • Palestrina
    Posts: 508
    I’d still like to know what the actual musical sources are…

    It’s a bit like those who harp on about the ‘ancient’ Rorate and Attende Domine. Yes, the texts are ancient but they’re cobbled together from a few places and the melodies are certainly not of the vintage of the texts.

    Any medievalists out there with a knowledge of Gregorian repertoires that haven’t remained in continuous use? That’s ultimately where I think these kinds of things will be. I’ve taken a look at the medieval chant databases but don’t know enough about these repertoires to know what I’m looking for. I’ve seen Ubi Caritas categorised as both a hymn and an ‘antiphon verse’ (whatever that is).
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,909
    @Palestrina
    If you are looking for some interesting 'Liturgical' music in the style of the Ubi Caritas I would suggest you look in a processional (Processionale).

    The other place to look is at the Tropes,
    Analecta Hymnica Vol. 47
    and
    Analecta Hymnica Vol. 49

    N.B. O Filii et... I think is a secular piece. In the past carols for various seasons were sung with much merriment, carolling (dancing and drinking). They were not for use inside the church but still contained religious and catechetical themes.

    The most ancient Liturgical Music is indexed here, http://gregorianik.uni-regensburg.de/gr/

    I have found an Easter Alleluia (with verse), that has fallen out of use. I intend to set it ready for Easter...

    Also Dom Guernager, 'The Liturgical Year' is another useful source.
    Thanked by 1Roborgelmeister
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