I can’t say I’m surprised. I wouldn’t mind listening to it as a form of entertainment….but at Mass….that’ll be a “no” from me, dawg.

It reminds me of John Michael Talbot's early work, such as this "Glory to God" from about 1980, when he was introducing Evangelicals to Catholic liturgy through his album "The Lord's Supper":
https://youtu.be/qff1ZOtw7dc

Bad music is bad music.

I could hardly believe the composer acknowledged that movies were the inspiration for a Mass setting. Does he not realize the inappropriateness of using music inspired by pop entertainment and pop musical soundtracks for a setting of the Mass ordinary?

Reminded me of this that I saw a few years ago: a parody Mass setting set to Star Wars music.

https://youtu.be/OOexC3fNmiA

But this setting sounds like something from an early-80s Chicago album.

Mass settings like this were part and parcel of the repertoire at the Newman Center near to where I used to live, so it's more of the same, really - Missa [P]et[er] Cetera.

I will say, though, you could choose worse inspirations than Chicago - or Alan Silvestri, or James Horner, for that matter. I've been obsessed with them since before my roommate in college got a chance to meet them, lucky expletive. Just don't play this mass setting backwards.

It's like the composer couldn't decide between duple and triple meter, so he said "Why not both?"

Ironically, it's these same types of people who shout from the rooftops for us to "get with the times" only to find their works stuck in the 1980s.

Andrew...are you...serious? Shouldn't there be purple?

I agree with Andrew that the arrangement and production enhancements in the recording make it sound much better than a typical parish would be able to pull off, even a P&W ensemble.

Using the sheet music images provided in the recording, I played through the Glory to God on the piano. It sounds like it's missing a lot. It falls flat in comparison with the recording. The rock drums, as in the recording, strike me as essential to providing the piece with its excitement. And without the brass it hardly sounds interesting.

It's not a piece whose melody stands on its own for congregational singing with simple instrumentation. It requires a rock ensemble with brass to sound good, and it's for soloists or for a band to sing. Some music is like that.

The eighth notes are too difficult for a congregation to sing correctly. I found myself wanting to ignore them and smooth out the melody into quarter notes. I think if any congregations attempt to sing it, they will smooth out the difficult rhythms as they do with "Be Not Afraid" and the like, or they'll just stand silently while the band performs the song.

And some of the accidentals will not be mastered by a congregation. The Eb in the melody against a G-major chord in measure 56 will not fly.

This setting seems to me to be OCP's attempt to compete with WLP's/GIA's very successful and widespread Mass of St. Anne. But whereas Mass of St. Anne can sound good with only a piano accompaniment and is quite singable for a congregation, I don't think Stephan's Mass of St. Kilian succeeds as well at that.

I could hardly believe the composer acknowledged that movies were the inspiration for a Mass setting. Does he not realize the inappropriateness of using music inspired by pop entertainment and pop musical soundtracks for a setting of the Mass ordinary?

I have made my thoughts on this well-known in other threads, particularly the recent PW tome.

Suffice it to say, your honor, I rest my case.

I love the band Chicago, BUT NOT IN CHURCH MUSIC! This is an abomination!
BMP

I don't know, guys. It would be hard to top the "Pirate Eucharist."

https://www.sjmpbooks.com/files/pirate.pdf

Does he not realize the inappropriateness of using music inspired by pop entertainment and pop musical soundtracks for a setting of the Mass ordinary?

To be fair, this isn't something alien to music prior to the Council. One example, di Lasso's Missa Entre vous filles is based on Clemens non Papa's 16th century equivalent of "Baby Got Back".

Jeff Ostrowski has commentary on what he has dubbed "Missa Back to the Future".

https://www.ccwatershed.org/2022/01/15/ocp-missa-back-to-the-future-not-kidding/

Does he lurk around this message board?

Jeff Ostrowski has commentary on what he has dubbed "Missa Back to the Future".

If he is lurking around here, we could certainly benefit from a comment or two from him, based on the sheer hilarity of the first paragraph of his article alone. The snark. That delicious, delicious snaaark.

My thoughts, as someone who plays contemporary music at Mass:

First, this isn't stylistically praise and worship. It has drums and guitar, but that's kind of where the similarities end. The sheet music has a key signature of C, but there are Bb and Eb major chords all over the place. In contrast, praise and worship uses mostly chords that belong to the key. The chord progressions, rhythms, and the ways the instrumentation are used are all some other style of music that I'm not that familiar with.

Gloria - I found it interesting to listen to but I couldn't remember the melody at the end. I agree with the above comments that the melody is not memorable and that the song gets all it's mojo from driving drums and guitar, which most parish ensembles couldn't reproduce. I also thought that some of the phrases seem to use not the most natural melody in what seemed to me to be an effort to avoid sounding like other mass settings. I think the text fits the music well. The time signature will intimidate less experienced ensembles. Overall this Gloria doesn't interest me much.

I Saw Water Flowing - I liked this quite a bit. I was impressed with the melody here. Has a good build, very convicting. In a couple placed words seemed forced into not enough space. Is the whole song here an approved lectionary text, or did he write some extra stuff?

Penitential Act, Option B - I think this is in some mode other than major or minor. Stylistically adjacent to chat. I liked it.

Kyrie - also seems to be in a mode other that major or minor, I liked it, though not as much as the other penitential act options and not as much as just the regular chant of the Kyrie.

Alleluia - I really like. Melody is awesome. I think this this is a very strong song that will work with basically any ensemble. I thought this was very creatively written and had a unique sound.

Sanctus - I didn't like. Seems like it tries too hard to use the melody from the Gloria, but the words don't fit as well. And, this melody already wasn't great when used for the Gloria. Something feels off about this to me in addition to what I've said so far but not sure how to describe it. I think this is the worst song of the lot.

Memorial Acclamation - is missing.

Lamb of God - Decent. No strong feelings.


In general, there aren't enough great parts to this Mass setting to interest me in acquiring it, save possibly for using the Alleluia as a stand-alone option. Annoyingly, this Mass setting is good at the things that are easy to write for and bad at the things that are hard to write for. I'm yet to find a contemporary Mass setting whose Gloria and Sanctus I love. Those tend to be the Achilles heels of Mass settings, and it tripped this one up too.

It's stipulated that everybody should sing the Creed, perhaps alternatim, and therefor as with the Gregorian chant there are standard settings.

Yeah, the Creed is just recited with apathy and indifference. Such a shame.

¿The Nicene Creed divisive? ¡ of course not !

You're missing out, a sung credo is wonderful! Not to mention desired by the Church.

My father was not given to spontaneous song, but when full of the joys of life he would erupt with the intonation of Credo III. Into the 1980s the congregation at Westminster Cathedral could shake the roof with it, and can still give a good account of it.
My 2012 CTS hand-missal gives Credo III, and in English an ICEL setting.

The practice of singing the Creed in the OF in the USA never got far off the ground in many places because of pragmatism buttressed by the US bishops' Committee on Liturgy's "Music in Catholic Worship" (1972) that advised: "It is usually preferable that the Creed be spoken in declamatory fashion rather than sung."

(To the best of my recollection, the three heavy-hitter (in terms of distribution through missalettes and early hymnals) settings of the Ordinary of the 1970s in the USA did not include a sung Creed: Kraehenbuehl's "Danish Amen Mass", Vermulst's "Peoples Mass", and Peloquin's "Mass of the Bells".)

This advice was not reconsidered in the US bishops' "Liturgical Music Today" (1982).

"Sing to The Lord" (2007), the more official successor document of the US bishops, erased but did not reverse that 1972 advice in the sense that it never commended singing the Creed, only described in distinction to reciting.

Consequently, there's been no particular movement to including musical settings of the Creed in new settings of the Ordinary in the USA.

The late great Dr Theodore Marier included a recto tono vernacular Creed in his hymnal, with harmonic organ and choral parts. It worked. Very well.

The last time I heard the Creed sung, was at a midnight mass Christmas 1966. The choir sang it to the music of "Sheep May Safely Graze." This was pre-novus ordo days using the 1965 missal.

In my Byzantine parish we sing the Creed every Sunday - no filioque.

You know, it is rather apt that the one thing we have been able to agree on across the board is that the Credo should be sung. Our creed really does unite us.

Give this version a try. The music is actually adapted from a Byzantine/Slavonic chant used in the Ukrainian Catholic Church. Before moving to Wisconsin, I had used a precursor of this at St. Thomas Aquinas in Charlottesville. After the ICEL text came out in 2010, I made the present setting. It can be sung either harmonized (as the Ukrainians would) or just as a monodic chant (hence the square note edition).