I don't see how liturgy becomes less important in the face of people leaving the faith - if anything, it becomes all the more important, in that it is the primary interface of most Catholics while they can still be influenced by the church. (Which is not to say that liturgy is a silver bullet or the only arrow in the quiver.)

After the second essay there is a very perceptive comment about how (1) the role of the father (something missing from the original woman's story) is indispensable, and (2) the example of how the parents lived are key handing on the faith. I know this is the case with my own parents with regard to me and my siblings, all but one of whom are still practicing Catholics. We can give only what we already have, so handing on the faith is just as hard as living it in the first place.

Keeping in mind these figures haven't been all that great for a number of years. I suspect the numbers may be even worse in Europe.

Germany gives a totally different picture. In Germany you pay a tax to be a church member.

In my parish I heard we have 1200 registered parishioners. Three Mass services on a weekend with an average of 100 to 150 in attendance. You might ask "where is everyone?" This brief statistic doesn't take into account for example, homebound. My point is to use caution when trying to make sense of these reports.

In my own life time church attendance has been in decline. I have oftentimes wondered why? Was it because of the feminist movement, was it because Saturday night Novenas plus other devotional practices were stopped essentially overnight in many parishes? Was it the introduction of folk style music in our Catholic liturgy? Was it the scandals of the late twentieth century? So many things to consider. What was it our Lord said, be on your guard.
.

In my own life time church attendance has been in decline.

I have seen it, too. My parish used to have probably double the attendance it has now. A number of us have discussed why, but I don't think we really settled on one specific thing that is the cause.

As the Anglicans know, dignified ceremony is important if we're going to treat the worship of God seriously.

On the other hand, dignified -- by itself -- isn't adequate to stir up the heart to respond to the offer of grace from God.

This is one reason why the Traditional Mass, celebrated well or poorly ( I hear such things happen) is better than the most dignified modern Ordo.

The United States has always been about a decade behind Europe in social/religious decline. You need look no further than there to see where we will be 10 years from now.

We have been at our present parish for 11 years. In that time, the number of registered members has fallen dramatically and Mass attendance has followed the same. The old people are dying off and most of their children are no longer Catholic (as we have witnessed at their funerals). There are very few children left in our parish. The worship has moved desperately in a Protestant direction to try to attract more people (has that ever actually worked in any Catholic parish?). I don't believe a turn toward traditional Catholic worship would draw any more, though, because the demographics of our area (southern Protestant) just do not support the notion of an increased Catholic presence.

">https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=171&v=YI0BdkAzo5Q

At about the 7:00 minute mark Princess Gloria states that economically, we are living in very good times yet spiritually we are living in very bad times. She next says that we may show the beauty of the liturgy to uplift everybody, but also live as catholics in a joyous way of life, as much as discipline/suffering are also involved.

I have noticed that luxury does lead to illusion and less willingness to trust God leading more of us to depend on ourself to survive, yet all along it is God working to grant us every blessing.

I think that to be the best example with our own life and actions, so to never give up or doubt God's mercy upon us in every cross we carry will help others to recognize in us, in some small way, that we our joyful in spirit having some extra supernatural power that is irresistable. Salvation is possible for all, but we ought to understand that the only one who we can save for certain is ourself. :-)

Who is so great a God as our God? Thou art the God who worketh wonders!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTkoHR-Ry4s

So says the beatitudes regarding a spirit of poverty:

"Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
4 Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth
6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you."

If you're part of the Orthodox church, it's better just to focus on your church and what you can do for it.

As a Byzantine Catholic, there is stability in the rite of St. John Chrysostom. It isn't so open to interpretation and is not so given to going off track because of the personal interpretations of any priest. Clericalism never developed in the east to the degree it did in the west. We love and respect our priests, but have no qualms about riding them out of town if they don't live up to their calling. I think we have a relationship with Rome that doesn't interfere with our day-to-day operations and for individual churches, that is as it should be. Popes were never intended to be micro-managers of the details of daily operations.

I have noted elsewhere at some time, that I know half a dozen or so families that have left Catholicism and converted to Orthodoxy. In this area, Orthodoxy has tripled in the last ten years in number of churches and members. This is the Protestant south so there is an appeal that Orthodoxy presents. I don't think the chaos in the Latin church at the moment is helping them any.

Schism? Most of the clergy I talk with on both sides seem to think we are more in disagreement than schism.

As Michael Voris was recently making note of, sexual sin in the clergy, has strong interconnections to other sins of clergy, concerning the Lex Orandi, lex credendi, affecting what we believe and teach that the faith of Jesus Christ is and via liturgical expression of them. More and more darkness leads to darkness. More of the light of Christ with repentance for our sins leads to eternal life.

I do agree, many of the people of the Church here and now must work toward greater sanctification. The supernatural Church, the bride of Christ remains spotless and pure, always. :-) To find our own sanctuary within the life of the local Church, where we have stability in our culture is the important. We gave a priest who will never leave us, and who preaches sound doctrine much like the great Fathers of the Church. That I am blessed with this myself, and have intentionally gone through effort to seek it out, is why I feel I remain joyful during sorrowful times. We carry our Crosses with Christ, and he redeems us!

In the current maelstrom of ambiguity, sexual perversion, crappy theology, timidity and apostasy WE NEED conversations like this! All Ten Commandments are being publicly flouted in Rome and around the Catholic world. We can’t just stand by and let this happen. Pachamama’s been chucked into the Tiber, Praise God. A great start! What next??? Mother Mary, Exterminatrix of Heresies, pray for us!"

https://creamcitycatholic.com/2019/10/21/a-conversation-with-john-henry-westen-lifesitenews/?v=7516fd43adaa

I though the Irish study and at least one other found that a Catholic priest was the least likely person to abuse a child. This implies that a protestant minster was more likely to be an abuser, so the first part of the above is untrue.

What Irish study?

The population of non-Catholic ministers in Ireland is likely not large enough for any robust conclusions to be drawn.

@ Ken of Sarum, I was going to say there's apparently some kind of collapse of Christianity in Rome, too. I'm ignoring the circus as best I can and carrying on with living an actually Christian, Catholic life, with all the bells and whistles, as much as circumstances and God's grace permit. But it's not easy, and I feel for friends and family who even when they have the grace of contrition and go and ask a priest about rectifying a sinful situation (New Age practices, cohabiting, recreational drug use, premarital relations, contraception, unworthy reception of Communion, etc etc) are told not to be so rigid. And if they ask me and I tell them the truth, they now have to decide whether to believe a 'rigid' friend, or their parish priest, friends, and neighbors who will laugh at THEM for being rigid too, if they try to do the right thing. God have mercy on us.

I was wondering, if there is such an extremely urgent need for priests in the Amazon, why can't the Pope call/order priests to GO there? Why aren't priests feeling the call to go there and serve the people of the Amazon? I can see that deacons may be necessary in these remote regions, but send ordained priests there, too!

>> Why aren't priests feeling the call to go there and serve the people of the Amazon?
There may be some who do; but they can't just go where they want.
Since V II, we hear 'the best thing you can do for the Catholic Church is to be a good _________'.
Before now, that meant Presbyterian, Orthodox, etc; now might it be updated to mean just about anybody?
It's hard to see how the Church will even have any missions, in the future.

The Ukrainian Orthodox Greek Catholic Church was created in 2009 by Basilian priests from Slovakia. They had 7 self-consecrated founding bishops who had broken away from the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church. As far as I know, their "church" is not recognized by anyone and they and Patriarch Elijah are all excommunicated. I wouldn't put too much stock in anything they have to say about anyone or anything.

The excommunication is fact. I will spare you the details leading up to it, but:

On March 29, 2012 the Vatican Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (CDF) published a declaration,[18] urged by the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church and dated February 22, 2012, concerning the main bishops of the UOGCC. It stated that CDF would not recognize the episcopal consecrations of the UOGCC's bishops as valid, and that the bishops of the UOGCC had been excommunicated.[19]

I've been reading and hearing about the collapse of Christianity in America for as long as I can remember (I'm 58). What we are seeing are those people who previously went to Church because it was expected socially no longer feel compelled to do so.

We just need to concentrate on our own salvation.

And even he had abandoned Jesus after his arrest in the garden, although a lot of people seem to be unaware of that. All the disciples deserted Jesus according to the Matthean and Markan accounts; the Lucan account instead has only Peter following Jesus at a distance.

Another detail that people miss after the Resurrection is that even by the time of the Ascension, according to the Matthean account some of the Eleven still *doubted*. It's not until Pentecost that the fear that apparently gripped the Eleven on the night of Holy Thursday was more completely overcome.