TTBB Mozart Mass
  • deltaday
    Posts: 5
    I'm searching desperately for a TTBB men's choral arrangement of one of Mozart's Masses. Preferably a Missa Brevis.
  • jefe
    Posts: 176
    Delta, I would like to see one too, if indeed it exists. Is it accompanied?
    jefe
  • ghmus7
    Posts: 1,130
    I doubt if any exist...
    It would be almost impossible to keep integrity in the counterpoint and harmony, and keep the work in the same key for the instruments.
    When SATB music is arranged for male voices, the key is usually dropped a third or fourth and other machinations are usually needed.
    I do have a TTBB arrangement of Ave Verum Corpus if you are interested.
    ghmus7@hotmail.com
  • francisfrancis
    Posts: 8,289
    In my opinion, do not concern yourself with Mozart. Move onto the earlier composers where the musical content is much more significant. Mozart was a kin to the St. Louis Jesuits of our day in his time.
  • Schönbergian
    Posts: 367
    The musical content of Mozart's Masses is absolutely significant. Don't lump him in with some of the operatic excesses of the nineteenth century or, God forbid, the sacro-pop "artists".
  • Schoenbergian,

    Since Francis doesn't like Mozart's music, he wishes to express exactly how much he doesn't like it by using this most evocative comparison. I'm amazed how often Francis and I agree.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • IdeK
    Posts: 48
    The only work of Mozart I know that is for a male choir is the masonic cantata "die Maurerfreude". Doesn't seem appropriate for mass, nor in any catholic occasion.

    (I can't say that I know all Mozart works, though).
  • Schönbergian
    Posts: 367
    But the comparison is simply untrue. There is a profound difference between a devoted Catholic doing his best to write, in the style he perfected, sacred music intended for Mass, and a group of deliberate iconoclasts with no recognizable talent. There's a reason Mozart has endured for two hundred years and sacro-pop is already seen as dated.
  • Liam
    Posts: 3,804
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  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 2,465
    Ah, Mozart.

    I dislike most of his music: his Masses are an exception, particularly his Missae Breves.

    Abp. Colloredo, a Josephinist who also banned pilgrimages and processions, had a law that Masses in Salzburg should last no longer than 45 minutes--and that 45 minutes includes everything from the Introit to the Last Gospel. As a result of this, Mozart's Missae Breves are compact, choral (only short solo or quartet passages intervene, save for the Benedictus), economical (violins, continuo, and colla parte trombones), and rely heavily on "stille antico" (imitation and fugue). If I was in a position where it would work (i.e., EF with staff soloists and musicians), I would make Mozart's Missae Breves, along with the two Haydns', Salieri's, & Schubert's part of repertoire.
  • Schoenbergian,

    One reason I dislike Mozart so much is that his music could have been beautiful, but is instead trite and cheap, which is to say it has characteristics of
    deliberate iconoclasts


  • jefe
    Posts: 176
    Still waiting for Mozart anything with male voices, preferably unaccompanied. A lot of Mozart has been transcribed for trombones beyond the warhorse Ave Verum Corpus.
    jefe
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • deltaday
    Posts: 5
    jefe. Our Cantatio 25 man chorus does several Mozart arrangements purchased from various publishers. Among the best are Adoramus te Christi, Dies Irae, Ave Verum, and Laudate Dominum w/Soprano Solo. Jack
  • ghmus7
    Posts: 1,130
    How in the world can any human who considers him or herself a musician, dislike Mozart? This is impossible.
  • ghmus7
    Posts: 1,130
    I can say, that there are very few original Mass settings for Male choir. There are some decent settings by some of the Cecelians such as Perosi and the like (certainly not works of genius) and there are some baroque masses for Male choir that you can find on cpdl. However the one significant exception is the Jubilate setting by Durufle, incredible.
  • deltaday
    Posts: 5
    ghmus. Our Cantatio has done several TTBB Masses quite successfully. Among the best are 'Missa Cordis Jesu' by Singenberger, and we'll be doing the Rheinberger 'Mass in Bb' with a 14 piece orchestra on SUN AUG 25 at 11am (we also did that one in 2017). We've also done Gounod, Stehle, Aigner, and others. Jack
    Thanked by 1StimsonInRehab
  • ghmus7
    Posts: 1,130
    Oh You are right, I forgot about yhe Rheinberger, which is a good piece.
  • jefe
    Posts: 176
    Jack, this is Jeff Reynolds the director of four Compline Choirs at Holy Trinity Episcopal Church in Nevada City CA. We've done around 150 Anglican with a Roman flavor offices of Compline over the past decade. Two of the groups, one large and one small, are all men with countertenors. I have composed, arranged, and transcribed 2500 pieces specifically suitable for Compline in the style of St. Mark's, Seattle's famous all male Compline Choir. Depending on having countertenors in your men's group, you may be able to use some of this or even produce your own Compline, which is a shoe-in for the men. There is a catch to my library of Compline music: it's free for the asking in either pdf or Sibelius formats. If you do not have countertenors, I have some TTBB music including packaged Complines for that voicing. The 5 changeable tunes for each Compline are;
    1. ORISON: a short, compact, introductory piece of music that sets the mood for the rest of the office. This can be in Gregorian chant, plainsong, harmonized, a homophonic chorale, in polyphony, or a through composed pieced. Sometimes we use a short Psalm as the Orison, or delete altogether for Lent. 2. HYMN: plainsong, Gregorian chant, harmonizations from the Hymnal or through composed arrangements may be used. 3. PSALM: I have well over 200 Psalm settings from single line Gregorian chant, in Anglican Chant Psalter, to 2, 3, 4, or 5 part harmonized settings. Most of these are the entire Psalm, not just a cherry-picked verse or two. 4. The Nunc dimittis with antiphon again from single line chant up 8 parts. I have about 75 settings. 5. THE ANTHEM: Our women's compline choir, Voces Angleorum sings some version of the 'AVE' in this slot, but we have many other tunes for appropriate liturgical times of the year. For more info, go to our f.b. site and of course like us: https://www.facebook.com/Trinity-Compline-Choirs-183931914983523/
    There are most of the recordings of Compline over the past few years on there. Below is the complete score to a 4-Psalm Compline for men using the assigned Psalms for Compline: 4. 31, 91, and 134.
  • ghmus7
    Posts: 1,130
    Jefe, thanks foe your info! I have a male choir at seminary which I am always looking to find music. Do you have a list of moderately easy choral pieces you might be able to share? - I am looking for TBB TTBB or even TB.
    Thank you. Gregory
    ghmus7@hotmail.com
  • Still searching for a Mozart Mass. Our Cantatio mens chorus has done 6-8 TTBB Mozart motets with great success. These were professionally arranged scores that successfully captured his style and spirit. We would like to add a Mozart Mass to our repertoire of Masses by other composers - Rheinberger, Singenberger, Stehle, Hassler, Gounod, and others.
    jefe. I did check out your Compline website this afternoon. I didn't find any links to specific pdf arrangements. I do doubt that we would be able to use much of what you've done.
    The Cantatio is a traditional 25-member TTBB chorus that sings 100% Latin music at a very traditional Roman Catholic Mass service. Our typical service includes 2 motets, and a complete Mass setting (Kyrie, Gloria, Credo, Sanctus, Benedictus, and Agnus Dei). A small group from the membership handles the extensive responses appropriate for that liturgical date in Gregorian Chant. Most of our music is composed in polyphonic style - a cappella, organ accompanied, and some orchestral presentations. Typical presentations are from Palestrina, Mendelssohn, Bach, Beethoven, Victoria, Vivaldi, etc.
    If you have any ideas about how I might find more suitable music, please let me know.
    deltaday@compuserve.com
  • ghmus7
    Posts: 1,130
    Hmm. I don't think I can help with a Mass setting by Mozart - but would you be willing to share the sources of your motets? I would be very interested. Of course I have a TTBB arr of ave Verum.
  • Adoramus Te, Dies Irae, Laudate Dominum are available from Sheet Music Plus.