Vatican Edition Kyriale additions
  • rarty
    Posts: 96
    As far as I can determine, all editions of the Vatican Edition Kyriale (1905) and Graduale (1908) do not include a Credo V, Credo VI or Gloria ad lib. IV (Ambrosian).

    By the 50s, in the Solesmes Liber Usualis/Graduale, these chants are included though, and the Graduale Simplex includes the Ambrosian Gloria, referenced as "ed. Vat. more Ambrosiano".

    So—are these "unofficial" chants that Solesmes added (like the Du Mont ordinaries that appear in a few Libers), or were they approved later as "Vatican Edition", like the several newly composed propers after 1908 (Sacred Heart, Assumption, etc.)?
    Thanked by 1JonathanKK
  • Josh
    Posts: 103
    The same applies to Credo VII, which I have as an insert, dated about 1933, in my Liber Usualis.
    Thanked by 1rarty
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,772
    In the 1924 Graduale Romanum, a section at the end of the Kyriale is titled, Alii Cantus ad libitum, notissima approbati
    Has the following,
    Gloria more Ambrosiano.
    Credo V
    Credo VI

    In the Kyriale 1961 there is also added Credo VII... although I am sure I have seen another 'Credo VII' with a different melody...
    Thanked by 1rarty
  • rarty
    Posts: 96
    Thanks tomjaw, that is very interesting. I assume that is a Solesmes Gradual. Looking through ccwatershed's copies, I now see that the 1924 Liber Usualis has the same section "novissime approbati". And an accompaniment book from 1929 (Potiron) has these integrated in with the rest of the Kyriale.

    But the 1953 Schwann Gradual doesn't. And most tellingly, the 1962 Missale Romanum, which has the intonations for every other Gloria and Credo, doesn't have the intonations for these.

    So I think maybe they fall into the "approved, but not Vatican Edition" category, like the Solesmes variants of the peregrinus psalm tone and the Magnificat solemn tone I/VI mediant.

    (Credo VII: The ICK website has a transcription they source to a 1927 Solesmes Gradual. Which makes sense together with tomjaw's 1924 (Solesmes?) Gradual already having V and VI.)
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,772
    @rarty

    The G.R. is no. 696 'Solesmes' and I suspect this is the original printing. I have 2 other copies of the G.R. 1924, and these copies are different with added pages and omitted pages.

    EDIT. Have just looked at the source for Credo VII on the ICK website and the imprimatur is 13 Sep. 1924!
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen rarty
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