Once again the CMAA Forum's "musical criticism" of new compositions posted on the site amounts to nothing more than how a score looks, how words are hyphenated, what fonts are used, add a sharp to that F and a flat to that B, and things of that sort. I guess, in the name of Christian charity, no one wants to offer an offending word about a composition?

Publishers do the same thing in their rejection letters, using something like "Your composition does not meet the editorial priorities of this publisher." I suppose "Your composition does not advance the betterment of liturgical music" would be too harsh?

Father Krisman,
This is the second post in which your tone seems quite shrill. For the record I, for one, would appreciate knowing "why?" Your "Once again, CMAA ____..." is a rhetorical device I would expect from my brother TF and others over at the loyal opposition, from which now even I have been banned. Glad you're still checking in.
Also for the record, your post does exactly what you criticize the comments thus far- it only addresses something other than the composition itself, unless your last sentence was a veiled assessment.
I you cull my writings here, the Cafe, my own blog and even at PTB, I calls 'em as I sees 'em. I have no problem specifying why, in certain musical terms, a Bob Hurd or Chuck Giffen Mass setting is worthy of attention. But, if I find elements I would edit, I communicate with those friends privately.
As you chose as of yet not to respond to my explanation of comments made in the objectionable hymn thread, I don't know whether to expect you to answer this post. But I am truly mystified as to why you have come across as contentious, needlessly so.

Father, I'll send you my thoughts about the personal stuff in a PM.
Now, do you have any observations of benefit to Fr. Waldman, insomuch as you called the question?

I'm sorry, did I miss part of the original post that said "substantial musical criticism only, no proof-reading remarks please"?

.

As a composition student in the university, we were essentially not graded on our musicality, but on our engraving skills. Sure we had composition and analysis excersizes, but visual aesthetics and clarity of communication of our ideas was paramount.

We put up with music that resembles a ransom note sometimes, so quaint in comparison.

Have a blessed Sunday!

Once again the CMAA Forum's "musical criticism" of new compositions posted on the site amounts to nothing more than how a score looks, how words are hyphenated, what fonts are used ...

My comment was the first one made, Fr Krisman, and I could not read the score, which is why I made the comment. In addition, as an editor with considerable experience in score preparation, I thought I was doing the composer a favor. I could not comment on the musicality of the score because I could not read it and play through it. I noticed just now that the score in question has been replaced by one that is legible, although there are missing hyphenation problems, which I have commented on, constructively, I think. If and when my left hand (which is having troubles) get me to the point that I can actually attempt to play through the score, I shall. In the meantime, I take the tenor of your remarks, as being sorely out of place. Others and I, too, have indeed commented on compositional details of newly posted works, albeit occasionally (or often, since I'm not privy to PM content except my own) via private correspondence. Truly, I'm disappointed in your remarks.

As it happens, those comments came in quickly after the composer's posting, and rather late in the evening, so it is not surprising that they were only based on immediate impressions, and not on playing the work.

Chonak's observation is quite correct. And, as I have stated above, I simply could not see the score well enough to read it, let alone try to play it.

That initial remark of mine was a general one about musical criticism on the Forum. I stand by it. I think such criticism on the Forum is almost entirely superficial. And perhaps that is due to the fact that contributors don't wish to say anything of substance which points to deficiencies in a given composition for fear that the remarks will be labeled as being uncharitable, testy, or shrill.

Fr Krisman, I'm not sure when your initial remark appeared, but it was on October 4, probably less than 24 hours after the score and my own first comment was posted late on October 3. Let's face it, you overstepped the bounds here and won't admit it.

If someone puts a piece out here (on the forum) for review and critique, it is fair game in EVERY department: layout, technique, style, content, musicality, musical theory, theological content, font usage, typography, engraving technique, and everything and anything else you can think of. I would expect anything and everything to be leveled at anything I would post here, and take EVERYTHING with a grain of salt or even an entire salt shaker that might be 'full of it'.

If you can't handle the most scathing of critiques, don't post here... or anywhere else. CMAA is no different than anywhere else EXCEPT you might get more for your money here. I have visited (sent my works for consideration) to a lot of other publishers... most of them are a joke. (I STILL have the rejection letters from major publishers who responded to me years ago, some saying I was 'too Catholic!' in my approach) Money and fame are not worth compromising the faith.

I took these comments out of that thread because the composer doesn't deserve to have his first discussion thread at the Forum overrun with cranky talk.

I take issue with this statement. We do not pubish "cranky talk", just personal (and honest) assessment from personalities from every walk and talk of real life, so my advice is to GET REAL. You will see your true colors in the mirror here. If you don't like the reflection, get some Botox.

I feel I can say these things only because I have probably posted more works on this forum more than any other composer, although I could be wrong. I have been shot through with critiques uncounted times (mostly because of my theology) and have never felt sorry for myself or shyed away because of anything anyone said, and there were times people ganged up on me.

Get tough or get lost.

If someone requests it, could a composition thread be locked so that all feedback is PMed or e-mailed?

(I'm not a composer, but I wonder if it might be a little easier/less intimidating for those who are starting out in composition.)

There's no technical obstacle to locking a thread on request, but there aren't moderators watching the forum constantly, so it might be some hours before I or another mod happened to see the request and have an opportunity to fulfill it.

But certainly, as CHG suggests, a composer can request that corrections be sent via e-mail or PM.

Also, I think there is value in the conversation, not just a bunch of individual comments. But I would think it should be up to the poster.

melo

PMing is good. But if we come here and ask for critiques, I would think anything is fair game.

It is my opinion that when a composer puts something here they are looking for approval on artistic content more than anything else. There is something about the creative spirit that embodies a strong drive and need to find SYMBIOSIS. It is not so much approval perhaps, but some kind of mystical longing to know if I have touched someone else, or better said, if God has touched someone else through my own creation, and if my own efforts and talents have risen to a place where what has been expressed is beyond my own human imagination and stirs something in the spiritual realm, especially in others. In short, what we long to know is if what we have created does indeed capture and communicate the essence of God himself in those elements of truth, goodness and beauty.