Questionnaire on music in the Church
  • donr
    Posts: 971
    I thought I would send out this questionnaire to other musicians in our parish to gauge their knowledge.
    Please provide alterations on this forum and then answer the questions and send to me @ donr@difbeats.com
    There are more than 30 questions so I did not post them here.
    Questions about Music for the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.pdf
    144K
  • kenstb
    Posts: 369
    donr,

    Your questionnaire reads more like a mini exam. Are you responsible for the other musicians in your parish? I don't think any of the so called musicians in my parish would be able to answer many of these questions. When are you hoping to send it to them?
    Thanked by 1Gavin
  • donr
    Posts: 971
    I am not the leader per se.
    This questionnaire wouldn't go out to all the musicians but to the "leaders" of the individual Masses.
    I just want to see where everyone is at in their knowledge so I can start to send them information based on that knowledge.

    This would be sent out only on approval of my pastor.
  • donr
    Posts: 971
    I am open to ways to make it better.
  • kenstb
    Posts: 369
    Understood. It might be cool to take the pulse of your colleagues in one on one conversations as well. Some people don't respond well to being questioned. Especially once they have assumed leadership roles. Egos and such.
    Thanked by 1Gavin
  • donr
    Posts: 971
    The idea of the questionnaire is to try to do away with the personal aspect or any kind of fighting that may go on between different groups (traditional vs contemporary).
    Maybe I'll ask the pastor to send it out so know one knows its coming from me.
  • TCJ
    Posts: 986
    I could see people getting awfully defensive if given that. The questions seem to be prodding them in a certain direction. While it's good to do that, it may make the people feel like they're being trapped. From there it's anyone's guess to how they will react.
  • donr
    Posts: 971
    I would like to make it better, maybe we could all work on it and produce a good questionnaire that would actually get answered.
  • kenstb
    Posts: 369
    donr, I don't think that your original idea was a bad one. I just think that a personal approach might get your colleagues pointed in the right direction a little easier than the written format. TALK to THEM. You might be pleasantly surprised.
    Thanked by 1donr
  • melofluentmelofluent
    Posts: 4,160
    I’m only doing this because of the novelty of the questionnaire.
    1 What is Liturgy? The worshipful product of the people (my definition, not etymological)
    2. Does the Church guide us to Liturgy or do we provide our own Liturgy to God? Both/And
    3. Is the music you provide for the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass considered Sacred Music?
    a. Yes
    b. No
    c. I Don’t know
    4. Do you know the definition of Sacred Music as the Church sees it?
    a. Yes
    b. No
    c. I don’t know
    If Yes, please provide it Well, even before CMAA I was no dummy. How does one who has half a mind ignore chant, polyphony, and the myriad evolutionary styles up through the twentieth century's end and into the new millenium purposefully ignore the art in and of itself, much less the sacral benefit it elicits when used as intended? 5. How do you choose music for Holy Mass? Ordinary: is it both beautiful and accessible. Propers, depends.
    a. Web Site Guide
    b. Publisher’s Guide
    c. Study the Scriptures of the day and choose from them
    d. Guess
    6. What is the purpose for music at Mass? To be the attendant (handmaid ) to the ritual action, which occasionally means the music IS the ritual action.
    7. Does the Church have a preference to what music is to be played/sung at Mass?
    a. Yes
    b. No
    c. I don’t know
    8. If yes, do you do this music?
    a. Yes
    b. No
    9. What is the “Ordinary” of the Mass? Penitential Rite: Asperges/Confiteor/Kyrie; Gloria (save when suppressed); Credo; Sanctus/Benedictus; (Mem. Accl. NO only); Amen (really just the NO, practically.) Agnus Dei. Changes for a Requiem.
    10. Do you sing or say the “Ordinary” parts of the Mass?
    a. Yes, if you're not interested in temporal matters, like stopwatches and parking lot issues
    b. No
    c. I don’t know
    11. List all the “Ordinary” parts of the Mass. Redundant.

  • bonniebede
    Posts: 756
    Hi, I read your questionnaire, and thought I would add a few comments. I sympathise with the desire to improve what is happening in your parish, as I do in mine. I am not the parish music director, nor am I the director of our main parish choir with whom I sing, so I appreciate that it is difficult when one feels things could be improved, but one doesn't have the right to say ok, we are changing this this and this. So how does one go about improving things in a more subtle way?
    First, I think your questionnaire is aimed at knowledge and information.
    This seems logical at first glance, because if people knew more, they could improve, right?
    But I believe attitude is the more important governing factor. It seems to me that the general dividing line between good and bad liturgical practitioners, including music ministers, is about whether you think of the liturgy as something you receive and transmit, or as something you create and perform.
    For the first group, the question of 'how well have I understood what has been given to me' makes perfect sense, to the second group it makes no sense at all.
    If the people you are trying to help have, basically, the first attitude, then the offer of better information is useful, and will be well received, if done humbly, gently, and incrementally.
    But for the second group, the offer could be seen as antithetical to what they think of as good liturgy. After all, if the essence of what you understand yourself to be doing is a creative exercise, then anything which comes across as rules, guidelines, etc is a limitation of your creativity, not an enhancement.
    So how can you help encourage a better attitude?
    I would suggest that a questionnaire such as yours might harden attitudes a bit, though please, I am only speculating and giving my own reflection here. I think I would try to access their attitude by opening up the question of who is the community that we draw our resources from?
    Basically what I am getting at is to encourage the attitude that when we are 'creating' liturgy we should be open to the breadth of lived experience in our church community. (Yes, I know such language might make your toes curl, but bear with me).
    So, for me a quick glance at our current music choices shows there is a vast preponderance of two types of music - 1970's Louis Jesuit type songs, and modern liturgical composers of dubious quality. We have a couple of nice choral pieces, a few nice hymns, no chant at all - not an untypical parish mix, I would say.
    So in order to be more inclusive in expressing the creativity of our church community, we would need to add to the mix a greater span of music drawn from across the ages, a wider range of modern composers and a greater variety of musical types, to include some chant. Of note here I would add that I always present Simple English propers or such as newly composed music, for modern young musicians. It is not untrue to present it this way, and one can always gradually explain how it 'draws on the resources of a longer musical tradition'.
    I think that unless you have the power and authority to change the direction of your parish music, then you have to be more subtle in your approach. I would use a questionnaire if I was given the authority, but without that authority it is not the route I would go.
    I suggest two alternative ways forward. First, offer a chance to study and sing together 'just for fun' to those parish musicians who are interested. Use it as an opportunity to read and reflect on church documents about music, and to introduce some new resources such as SEP. not everyone will take to it, but you will be building up a supportive cohort, which will eventually tip the balance, especially if combined with strategy 2.
    Strategy 2 is to take the longer view and work with the children. Start a children's schola. Teach the children all the riches that our generation were denied. Think about who will be singing in your parish in 20 years time. Educate them. They say that bank tellers learn to differentiate real money from counterfeit from constantly handling both. Raise up a generation who knows, sings and loves good liturgy. They will be readily able to tell the difference between good and bad liturgy. Someday the revolution will happen, and the young rebels will move in and takeover, simply by growing up. Then we will see 'that old music' dumped and the new, young peoples music come in... which of course will mean chant and good liturgy.
    Going back to the questionnaire, here how I would frame it:
    1. Do you feel it is important for parish musicians to be supported in their ministry?
    2. If there was an occasional support/study group what resources would you like to be offered (choose all you desire)
    a. Reflection on the renewed vision of the liturgy in Vatican 2
    b. New Music resources produced in the last ten years
    c. Songs and hymns which teach our children through music
    d. Simple music to encourage congregational singing
    e. Quality music suitable for the voices in our group (specify your parishes particular situations. ie in our parish our choir has no men)
    3. How often would you like to meet? Weekly, monthly, biannually, etc
    4. Would you like some spiritual resources to help you personally in your ministry?

    And the resources on offer ...Can't you make some of the vast resources on CMAA fit you questionnaire? For example SEP is a new music resource, it embodies Vat 2 call to make greg chant the model for our music, it is quality music suitable to a range of voices, it teaches our children scripture, because the propers are all scripture texts, if seasonal chants are used the congregation can be provided with simple singing aids and can join in.... etc etc etc.

    In summary, if you can't take a program and make it into what you want, pour in good resources and let the good drive out the bad.
    Oops, didn't mean to write and essay, but there you have.

    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • dad29
    Posts: 2,232
    @Melo: SC tells us that music is "an integral part" of the liturgy. I've had a hard time reconciling that statement with praxis, too.
  • melofluentmelofluent
    Posts: 4,160
    Hey Dad! Lest we think that clericalism rules in that equation, I'd remind our viewers we're all over the map in this hallowed forum. At any point in a dialectic some here literally long for the Low Mass lecta style like a parrot pines for the fiords whilst I'm solidly in the corner of Solemnis and Requiems.
    And of course, each of us represents the vox populi!
  • I recommend a totally different approach, but only if the pastor has charged you with "improving" the work of other musicians.

    Write them a very friendly letter asking, "In what ways are we weak, we really want to know." giving them the opportunity to tell you what they think about music at Mass. I'd avoid using the word "liturgy".

    Then you take all their responses and create a letter to them paraphrasing what they have said and then outline, briefly, ways to improve upon the weaknesses that they have perceived.

    Most Catholic musicians know very little about the subjects you have covered and will be turned off and may even get angry with you and, along with their friends, work against you. I am sure that this is not your intent.

    As I wrote this Bonnie's excellent post appeared, she has very good ideas there!

  • donr
    Posts: 971
    Thank you all for the thoughts.
    I will take your advice and seriously contimate it.
    I certainly do not want to anger anyone, I just want to teach them, trying to figure out where they are now so I can start to show them what the ideal is.

    Thanks again there is great advice here.

    I knew asking for comments would provide good advice and that is why I didn't just send it out.
  • I knew asking for comments would provide good advice and that is why I didn't just send it out.


    Thanks for trusting us all!
    Thanked by 1kenstb