Core Hymnody - What do we need?

Carl D

I guess I can see how video can be tacky, but honestly I don't get too fussed about it. I haven't seen anybody try to put up a rotating GIF or a cat video. People care about how their worship space looks, so you end up with the same good and attributes as you see with other artwork and so on.

I've done quite a few of the projection slides myself - text only, or with music. It's not as easy as it first looks. Laying out a book isn't as easy as it looks either.

Back to our regularly scheduled discussion; sorry for the diversion.

Adam Wood

Back to Gavin's thread....

It seems like the idea of "Core hymnody which everyone should know" is almost a circular, or self-reinforcing notion: Why should EVERY CATHOLIC know "Holy, Holy, Holy"? At least part of the answer is that ALMOST EVERY CATHOLIC already knows it.

And, even when trying to rise above "These are my favorites," at least a big part of the compilation of such a list is predicated on "I can't imagine my own faith life without this hymn" and "I would be really sad if this hymn wasn't in my hymnal."

Which then makes me wonder if "Core Hymnody" is something that simply occurs naturally in any parish with a sane music director and a decent hymnal.

So then I wonder... what exactly is the purpose of identifying 50 or 100 (or whatever) hymns for a core repertoire?

I can think of one useful purpose off the top of my head:

I always try, as much as I am able, to select hymn texts to fit the lectionary. I think most people who are using hymns do this to some extent or another. BUT OF COURSE: There are many Sundays throughout the cycle where this is not possible. Or where one cannot really find 3 to 5 pieces of music that make sense all together with those readings.

Various attempts at "Hymn of the Sunday" collections are interesting efforts, but I have them somewhat wanting.

So - when nothing fits in particular, I - like most MDs, I imagine - just pick a general hymn of praise (or a general Eucharistic hymn, or whatever) and use it. Having a go to list to draw from makes that process more organized. Also, it helps so that you can make sure you are cycling through with some decent combination of variety and regularity. If you think "Come Thou Fount" should be part of core rep, putting it on a list somewhere helps you make sure you don't forget to sing it a couple times a year, even if the lectionary never shouts at you about it.

As for WHAT HYMNS IN PARTICULAR should be on that list?
Have 5 Catholics of different ages thumb through the Episcopal 1982 hymnal and post-it note every hymn they know. Any hymn with two or more post-its is part of core rep.

Chris Garton-Zavesky

Adam,

I don't have a problem with projection screens either.

I simply think that they have no place whatsoever in a Church building being used for the worship of Almighty God.

donr

Why should EVERY CATHOLIC know "Holy, Holy, Holy"? At least part of the answer is that ALMOST EVERY CATHOLIC already knows

it.

Adam, I know you didn't mean it as such but this is a funny joke.

I am constantly introducing new (to my choir) "very standard" hymns that we all here grew up on but not one of my choir knows.

I am talking about "Holy, Holy, Holy", "Immaculate Mary", "Soul of My Savior", "Holy God, We Praise Thy Name", etc, etc, etc.

These were hymns I thought they would know. Every Catholic should know these but they had never heard them before.

I believe, and I know that there are other choirs out there being lead by 20 something year olds, who have never heard these songs before. I think a common core of hymns put out by CMAA or Illuminare Publications or The Catholic Choir Book, or CCWaterShed or ? is the best thing that these Organizations can do.

When some young DM searches the web for Core Catholic Hymns, he will be directed to all of these sites for their thoughts.

I am having a very hard time understanding why this is becoming such a difficult subject for you all.

G

"Core Hymnody" is something that simply occurs naturally in any parish with a sane music director

.... and usually with another kind of music director, as well.
My parish's "core hymnody" had consisted of All are Welcome, Gather Us In, You Are Near, Sing a New Song, Here, I Am Lord and Be Not Afraid. Literally, I believe at least two of these were sung every week.

On the other hand, when I was doing school Masses and found out they knew none, literally none of what I would think of as Top 40, (except for two Marian hymns,) I programmed some hymns more often than I would have done in subsequent years.
But one teacher absolutely refused to sing on "Praise to the Lord," because he said that when he was growing up that was the opening song to Mass every week.

Having a go to list to draw from makes that process more organized. Also, it helps so that you can make sure you are cycling through with some decent combination of variety and regularity.

I agree -- it also helps you keep track, so you can prove to your choir when they get bored that you didn't really sing something 11 times in the last 3 months.

I think everyone eventually ends up with his own go-to list of "core hymnody," but that the idea of a more universal list that "should" all be used is not just unrealistic, but coming from any group, I can think of, whether it's the GIA, CMAA, NPM, or the USCCB, a bad idea.

(Save the Liturgy, Save the World)

Chris Garton-Zavesky

any parish with a sane music director

Reading the comments hereabouts ...... these might not be quite as common as one might hope? ( I can't make a purple font).

eft94530

G: coming from any group, I can think of, whether it's the GIA, CMAA, NPM, or the USCCB, a bad idea.

The "USCCB ... idea" is that every USA hymnal published would contain their choices.
Selecting for local parish use is a different question.

melofluent

Nice avatar pic, eft.
The concept I can't wrap my brain around is that the USCCB actually can reach consensus on any emergent "idea." I know that we can't lay the ICEL chant Mass setting at their feet, but I don't want to assign "blame" to Fr. Ruff and ICEL either for just taking Iubilate Deo and proffering that as the go to English chant version assigned to all MR3 Missal editions. Given their corporate modus for avoiding decisions-liturgical, should we expect a white list only for English hymn texts, or Spanish as well? Will those texts be attended by mandated tunes by USCCB as well? The mind reels....

eft94530

The USCCB idea is a response to the Vatican
Liturgiam authenticam (2001-may-7) # 108

This forum repeatedly brings up old topics so often
that earlier useful posts are overlooked or ignored.

http://forum.musicasacra.com/forum/discussion/3469

eft94530

Earlier in this Discussion @donr listed categories; I extend the categories with:
Benediction
Stations of the Cross

vogelkw

Above it was mentioned that a list of core hymns depends upon the ordinary of a specific diocese. Since its creation in 2010, my diocese has a Core Repertoire of music. It contains two Mass settings, a list of 78 hymns, and 14 antiphons with psalms to be used ad libitum for Entrance, Offertory, and Communion propers. Recently entrance, song of farewell, and procession to place of committal antiphons for the funeral Mass were added.

Are there other dioceses with such core repertoires? I know that Bishop Sample gave something of a core standard for Marquette in his 2013 letter (Sung Orations and Dialogues from Roman Missal, one English Mass setting, Masses VIII and XVIII, general principles for hymns but no core list).

Here is some of what our bishop says in the Preface of our repertoire:

"I have also asked a group of liturgical musicians from parishes across the archdiocese to develop a core list of psalms and hymns for use in all of our parishes. No parish will be restricted to using only the pieces on the list, but I do want us all to have access to music that is beautiful, singable and theologically sound in its expression. Much of this good music is already known to us. I would like to think that in every parish, the quality of our liturgical music and the level of participation could be raised a notch or two from what we have been doing. This is an integral part of our being drawn more fully into the sacred mysteries we celebrate at Mass." (Archbishop George Lucas, 2010)

While our core repertoire is being implemented at diocesan events, I am unaware as to how much of an impact it has had thus far at individual parishes. At my own it has been rather limited. Of course, it has been only a short time.

BruceL

Father Vogel, nice to see you on here! To my knowledge, your archdiocese is the only one to have this. It's a wonderful thing that Dr. Rubis-Bauer and the archbishop have done this! Also, the way the Mass of St. Cecilia was commissioned (along with the copyright provisions) was genius. Thanks for remind us all of this!

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