Chant Camp for Children: a promotional video unlike most promotional videos
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    This forum's very own Mary Ann Carr-Wilson is featured on video explaining her parish's Chant Camp.

    Said video is viewable (among other places, I'm sure) at the blog of one Fr. John Zuhlsdorf, wdtprs.com/blog.

    (Presuming that many CMAA members or visitors to this forum don't know Fr. Zuhlsdorf, I'll point out that the URL is short for "What does the prayer Really Say".)

    Kudos to Mary Ann and Fr. Gismondi and the whole of St. Anne's parish!

    Here's are two discussion questions for the forum:

    Why do we as a country (and for Catholics commenting, why do we as Catholics in 2014) think (or want to believe) that children can't and won't learn this stuff?

    Could this kind of a camp serve as an evangelical tool --- i.e., not to deepen the faith of those who are already Catholic, but to draw disbelievers to the faith, or bring the faith to them?
    Thanked by 1canadash
  • MaryAnn Carr WilsonMaryAnn Carr Wilson
    Posts: 1,738
    Thanks, Chris, for the great questions.
    I hope to hear some thought provoking answers, and I'll keep mine short in hopes of other folks running with the ball.

    1) People who think like this simply don't have any experiential knowledge of decent teachers working with moderately interested young singers. They just don't know what they don't know.

    2) Yes, yes, and AMEN!
    Thanked by 2Ben CHGiffen
  • MaryAnn Carr WilsonMaryAnn Carr Wilson
    Posts: 1,738
    Bumpity bump

    C'mon people?! Any thoughts in this?
    Don't hold back!

    Don't wait for wild posts and miss the chance to comment on something quirky!

    Join the revolution in the (high, coastal) desert!
  • donr
    Posts: 971
    We as a Country (especially Catholics) think that children can't or won't learn this stuff because its perceived as being difficult or impossible for us older farts to learn. We put up barriers around ourselves to shield us from embarrassment and then project our feelings and misconceptions as others think this way as well. Children certainly won't be able to if I'm afraid!

    I believe that if done right it would most certainly be an evangelical tool.

    Yesterday I heard a nice blurb on EWTN about the Chant Camp. It was very well done.
  • ryandryand
    Posts: 1,640
    Why do we as a country (and for Catholics commenting, why do we as Catholics in 2014) think (or want to believe) that children can't and won't learn this stuff?


    "We" are spoken for by ill-informed baby-boomers who bemoan their pastor's choice to use the chants IN THE NEW ROMAN MISSAL as "turning back the clock" to pre-Vatican II times (in spite of the council's clear view on this).

    "We" don't want anything to do with this type of music.

    "We" are not used to it, and "we" do not have any desire to learn anything about it or how to utilize it.

    So "we" construct an absolute lie that children cannot learn it.

    PERSONAL EXPERIENCE SHOWS that children LOVE learning chant. At a parochial school in a poor ghetto neighborhood, the students instinctively identified it as "church music," and there were kids as young as 7 who were so excited to be practicing their favorite Sanctus (in Latin) that you'd think it was time for recess.

    Those who participate in the lie that children cannot and will not learn this have zero actual knowledge of the music themselves and by extension have absolutely no practical experience sharing the church's treasury of sacred music with children. They speak out of ignorance at the intellectual and experiential level.

    More than anything, they continue to delude themselves that their alternatives are seen as desirable or hip by the youth. When children respond the way I have described, and when major university Newman centers have higher attendance at the sacred music vs. the contemporary rock masses, its clear that the detractors are living in a fantasy world. They say that this music cannot connect with people. Children can't learn it, young adults won't be attracted to it, it has no relevance today, etc etc etc. It's all a lie, and the front lines of parishes in reform of the reform are proof enough.

    Bring this idea to the discussion, though, and "we" will plug our ears and scream LALALA as if "we" are the toddler siblings of the 7-year-old students excited about Latin chant.

    Could this kind of a camp serve as an evangelical tool --- i.e., not to deepen the faith of those who are already Catholic, but to draw disbelievers to the faith, or bring the faith to them?


    It can and does deepen the faith of those already Catholic.
    It can and does draw believers to the faith.
    It can and does bring the faith to them.


    Other goofy sing-a-longs are mocked by those without faith (or of other denominations). You should see the look of surprise on friends' faces when they hear that there is "Christian rock" in RC parishes. "Wait, they do that? Don't you go to CATHOLIC churches?"

    Sad when the outsiders "get it" more than those in the sanctuary.

    On the contrary, when they hear sacred music, whether Gregorian chant or vernacular plainsong, even outside of the church walls, they are enthralled. "That's so beautiful, what church do they do that in? I want to go."
  • Musicteacher56
    Posts: 621
    People are convinced children can't learn chant? I beg to differ. In the three years I've served as music director in my parish, I have not only formed a children's choir, but have taught them several chants (they now know by heart), and several parents have commented that they hear their children chanting in the shower. I also teach at another Catholic School whose history includes little sacred music, and a LOT of what is so often referred to as "OCP standards". When I took over the choir I told them right off we were going to learn something amazing that has been around for a very, very LONG time. The children were enthralled and once we began the chants, the enthusiasm grew.

    That enthusiasm has brought many family members to our children's masses, some of which haven't been in a church in quite a while. So, yes, it can be used as an evangelical tool.

    The hearts of children are pure and clean and are untainted by opinions, for they see beauty in everything and are particularly attracted to that which is simplistic in form, but from which beauty derives.
    Thanked by 3ryand canadash donr
  • Chris Garton-Zavesky
    Posts: 6,902
    Musicteacher 56,

    Yes, you're right, that children love the stuff when it's introduced properly. Parents -- that depends on what "baggage" they carry with them. When their premise masquerades as a conclusion.....

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