• dvalerio
    Posts: 341
    The Vespers of the Little Office of the Blessed Virgin Mary for the Extraordinary From (outside Advent and Easter Season) are found in pages [89] and ff. of the 1912 Antiphonale. (See pp. [94] and ff. for Advent, and p. [98] for Easter Season.)
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    Thank you so much for all the info and suggestions. I'm still learning. It will take time and discipline for me to put it together, but I will post oneday," We did Vespers today and it was beautiful."
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,605
    Cursing...

    Ralph, I DO want to know...

    Do you know the three psalms that are never used because the contain too much cursing?
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,605
    Having read and re-read...HELP!

    We are having Evening Prayer every Wednesday, starting two weeks ago. At this point we are singing an Evening Hymn and then singing the Magnificat in English to a Single Anglican Chant Tune.

    The deacon has downloaded each week's servive from eBreviary.com

    So I know that it is a 4 week cycle. BUT does that cycle vary with seasons?

    Where, o where...is someplace on the Internet where one might go and find a clear chart with links to everything needed to sing Evening Prayer in the OF?
  • TBL
    Posts: 13
    The three psalms not said in the current LOTH are (using the Hebrew numbering) 58, 83, and 109.

    The 4 week psalter doesn't really vary with the seasons (besides resetting to Week I at the beginning of each season); sometimes the antiphons are proper. The rest of the office of Vespers does typically vary. And some parts, at least the Magnificat antiphon and the concluding prayer, are specific to each day.
  • dvalerio
    Posts: 341
    > The 4 week psalter doesn't really vary with the seasons

    Not in Vespers, though in the Office of Readings there are changes with the season: «Three psalms (78, 105, and 106) are reserved for the seasons of Advent, Christmas, Lent, and Easter, because they throw a special light on the Old Testament history of salvation as the forerunner of its fulfillment in the New.» (GILH §30)
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,605
    TBL and dvalerio, thanks.

    Now this remains very, very confusing....the clearer people try to be, and people are trying, the less clear it becomes.

    I mean...why does the church have a Rite that is not clearly defined for general use?
  • dvalerio
    Posts: 341
    > why does the church have a Rite that is not clearly defined for general use?

    If you stick to SAYING the Office it's really not that hard. Just follow the Liturgia Horarum book (1 volume per season). Problems arise when you want to SING it in Gregorian chant, since antiphons are not those given in the book, but are rather those from the Ordo Cantus Officii, and there's still no book with all the stuff organised. (But don't forget Les heures grégoriennes, discussed here, that however ommit the Office of Readings.)
  • I know this is an old thread, however some of us are still confused! Our priest is asking for Vespers (possibly to the BVM). I am looking at 'Mass and Vespers' right now but am still overwhelmed. Any help (VESPERS FOR DUMMIES) would be appreciated! Specifically- here is what you should do.......
  • Simon
    Posts: 153
    Our Schola sings latin vespers every Sunday from Sept. to June - the men 2nd, 4th and eventually a 5th Sunday, women the 1st and 3rd Sundays. We men elect to sing the monastic version of vespers as outlined in the Ant. Monasticum (from the 1930's I believe - the Solesmes edition). We (6-10 men) sing them antiphonally without a priest. (You don't need them - they just complicate things). It's easy to do. The choreography is also one that - with a little practice - is attractive as well. The psalms are almost always the same every Sunday. Here is the text from our English language information sheet that we have for foreign listeners (we're a Dutch choir in Amsterdam).

    Welcome to the St. Nicholas Church and the vesper service this Sunday afternoon. Gregorian chant vesper services are sung in this church every Sunday from September to June by the Schola Cantorum Amsterdam. Vespers is the evening prayer service of the Roman Catholic liturgy of the canonical hours. The format sung today was prescribed by St. Benedict (ca. 480 - ca. 547) in his Rule for monks. The service is sung entirely in Latin with Gregorian chant melodies - many of which originate in the early middle ages (800 to 1000 AD). Today, outside a few monastic communities, it is increasingly rare to hear such a service. We hope you find in today’s service some of the devotional peace and ethereal beauty that many – even many non-Christians – have experienced in this worship service over the centuries.

    The general structure of our vesper service (duration 35-40 minutes) is as follows:
    ▪ Vespers opens with the chanting of Deus, in adiutorium meum intende. (O God come to my assistance. O Lord make haste to help me. Glory be to the Father…)

    ▪ Here follows the chanting of four psalms (psalm numbers 110-113 ) each preceded and followed by an antiphon (a short response). The psalms are sung antiphonally – two groups of singers alternate the singing of the psalm verses. During the period between Easter and Pentecost a single antiphon preceding and concluding the singing of all four psalms is sung – a festal Alleluia, alleluia, alleluia.

    ▪ After the psalms and a brief pause for reflection there is a reading (chanted) of a short capitulum – a simple recitation of one or two Bible verses fitting to the liturgical season.

    ▪ A sung respond (responsorium) follows the capitulum. The respond may be a short or lesser respond (responsorium breve) or long or greater respond (responsorium prolixum). The latter is often taken from the matins (night office) and will be the most elaborate piece of Gregorian chant one hears in a vesper service.

    ▪ A hymn is then sung. On Sundays, during ordinary time, the hymn is devoted to the praise of the first day of the creation - the following days in the week, at vespers, recounting the succeeding days of the creation. On feast days an appropriate festal hymn is sung. The hymn is followed by a versicle (a short devotional sentence).

    ▪ The choir then sings the Magnificat – the canticle of the Blessed Virgin Mary from the Gospel of Luke chapter 1 verses 46-55 (My soul doth magnify the Lord…). The Magnificat, as in the psalms, is sung antiphonally and is preceded and followed by an antiphon.

    ▪ The preces (prayers) are then sung – Kyrie eleison, Christe eleison, Kyrie eleison, followed by the Pater noster (the Lord’s Prayer), and the prayer of the day.

    ▪ The service concludes with Benedicamus Domino. Deo gratias. (Let us bless the Lord. Thanks be to God.) A low recitation is chanted - reflecting our thoughts with the faithful departed and those absent today. A devotional hymn to the Blessed Virgin Mary may conclude the service.
  • Simon: This is wonderful. Thanks!
  • eft94530eft94530
    Posts: 1,577
    Vespers (possibly to the BVM)

    If you mean Vespers of the Little Office of the BVM,
    that is mentioned in a previous comment somewhere above,
    but probably deserves a separate Discussion.

    Please specify
    --extraordinary form or ordinary form
    --the exact Feast of the BVM (provide the name from the Calendar)
    --the date it will be prayed (provide weekday month day)
  • eft94530eft94530
    Posts: 1,577
    Ordinary Form (Post Vatican Two)
    Liturgy of the Hours (aka LOTH) (aka Divine Office) (aka Breviary)

    The LOTH has seven "hours" or times of prayer to sanctify the day:
    Office of Readings (OR), Morning Prayer (MP),
    Mid-morning Prayer, Mid-day Prayer, Mid-afternoon Prayer,
    Evening Prayer (EP), Night Prayer (NP).
    Each has a duration of less than thirty minutes.

    There are several publishers of these providing different form factors
    containing one or more of these hours.

    Catholic Book Publishing Company four volume set "Liturgy of the Hours".
    Each volume contains all hours for a chunk of the liturgical year and is self-contained
    (i.e., Vol 1 Advent and Christmas, Vol 2 Lent and Easter, ...).

    Catholic Book Publishing Company one volume set "Christian Prayer".
    It contains a subset of the hours (e.g., MP, EP, NP).
    Another volume is "Shorter Christian Prayer" which has
    at least MP and EP; there is a large print version of this too.

    Daughters of Saint Paul two volume set "___".
    The small black (4x5) volume contains all hours except the Office of Readings.
    The large beige (6x9) volume contains only Office of Readings.

    Every priest / deacon / religious (male, female) has one of the above.
    Borrow them for an hour and review their contents.

    Regardless of publisher a volume has these sections:
    Proper of Seasons, Ordinary, Psalter, Proper of Saints, Commons.
    I think the Sacramentary has the same layout.

    Look for the Ordinary;
    it is the roadmap with rubrics (red, italic?) and text (black, normal?)
    for each of the hours. You will refer to the Ordinary frequently.

    Within the Ordinary, look for the heading Evening Prayer (EP)
    and skim read through the material a few times to become familiar with the outline of EP:
    Introduction
    Hymn
    Psalmody
    Reading
    Response
    Canticle
    Intercessions
    Dismissal

    Each part of the hour requires material from various volume sections
    (from the Proper or Common or use the default).
    These details are clear in the Ordinary rubrics.
    As soon as you execute the material, you return to the Ordinary.

    For the OF, the Mass has the GIRM; the Liturgy of the Hours has the GILH:
    http://www.fdlc.org/Liturgy_Resources/general_instruction_of_the_liturgy_of_the_hours.htm

    We can address your specific situation in a separate post.
    Thanked by 1Jes
  • rich_enough
    Posts: 1,033
    The Catholic Book Publishing Company publishes annually an "ordo" for the LOTH entitled "ST. JOSEPH GUIDE FOR THE LITURGY OF THE HOURS." Like an ordo for mass, it which lays out the requirements for every day of the year. It says nothing about music, however.

    Sam Schmitt
  • pipesnposaune, You say you are looking at "Mass and Vespers" but are you planning Vespers in the Ordinary or Extraordinary form? If the latter, go to http://officiumdivinum.org/ and look at the order of texts to be sure.
  • @ Michael, I found out today Father would like the Extraordinary form. Thank you for the link. @eft Father has not set a specific date. Obviously we cannot rehearse music until a day is chosen, yes?
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,160
    You could work on the Mass ordinary.
  • @ Chonak- Yes, they have a good start on those! We might just begin the Magnificat until all the details are set. Thank you all for help- wish we did not have to reinvent the wheel.
  • eft94530eft94530
    Posts: 1,577
    Knowing the specific date is important.
    The liturgical calendar has requirements that might preempt your desires.
  • bgeorge77
    Posts: 190
    I didn't want to let this thread go without posting this resource:

    http://www.transitofvenus.nl/LiturgiaHorarum/

    All the Sunday's Vespers1/Lauds/Vespers2 for the Novus Ordo Liturgia Horarium, ready-made in PDF pamplets, beautifully done WITH GREGORIAN NOTATION!
    Thanked by 1Jes
  • Remember you can't start the Magnificat until you know what tone to use. This is based on the mode of the antiphon for the Magnificat. Sorry! Pin him down and get started. The EF Vespers is so wonderful.
  • We're going to do the feast of the Assumption. Praise God this endeavor is getting more solid!
  • Great chants for the Assumption, but so little time to rehearse!
  • Chrism
    Posts: 868
    Assumption II Vespers - Perhaps this will be of help.
  • Chrism, she is doing the EF Vespers, but your program is a nice one for the OF.
  • unfatmatt
    Posts: 29
    Was there every any resource offered for the n00b learning EF Vespers?

    Also, when introducing a congregation to EF Vespers, are they supposed to actually sing half of each Psalm?
  • I found an online copy of the EF Antiphonale, and I have one question: is there no 4-week cycle in the EF Vespers?
  • Nope. It's one-week.
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,704
    If you want to know what to sing for Vespers, or any other Hour of the Divine Office...

    http://divinumofficium.com/cgi-bin/horas/officium.pl

    N.B.
    1. Make sure you have clicked of the right option Rubrics (usually Rubrics 1960) we use Divino Afflatu at our Parish, ask the celebrant.
    2. You can use this site to see how Vespers changes over the week.
    3. This site is only useful for the E.F., the 1960 new calendar option is only a proposal.
  • JesJes
    Posts: 574
    @bgeorge77 does that resource still exist? I get a 404 error :( Please would love it!