Singing the Liturgy of the Hours in Latin
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,934
    Although I am not Orthodox but Greek Catholic, we do use the same liturgy. I can assure you Vasily is right about the length of vigils. In the eastern churches less may be more, but more is better. :-)
  • francis
    Posts: 10,668
    OK

    So what is the best immediate solution for singing an authentic LOTH then? (have two copies, one from 1939 and one from the 50's I believe) By reading this thread it appears that the Liber is still the only choice. (I have also downloaded the Antiphonale PDF) Would you all agree?
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,160
    The 1934 Antiphonale Monasticum is another, if you don't mind following the monastic practice.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,668
    How different are the two, Chonak?
  • I'm currently compiling congregational booklets for the Liturgy of the Hours, using Gregorian chant. It's still a work in progress, but I attached a first attempt - not complete yet (the reason becomes clear in what follows) - so you can see if it is of any use.

    I'm following the Ordo Cantus Officii and, like others in this thread, I'm starting to wonder whether those who put the Ordo together ever thought the Liturgia Horarum should actually be sung: many antiphons are hard to find, some aren't even associated with any existing music. Luckily, a couple of gaps are now filled by the new three volume Antiphonale Monasticum, but I'm eagerly awaiting a new edition of the Antiphonale Romanum.

    For instance, the second Vespers of the first Sunday of Advent already gives a problem. The second antiphon is Rex noster and CAO number 2655 is given as a reference (from texts of office chants edited in R.-J. Hesbert's Corpus Antiphonalium Officii, vols. 3+4). However, according to this CAO search, CAO 2655 is the antiphon Erat Jesus docens (quite unlikely for Advent), while Rex noster is an invitatorium antiphon with CAO 1155. Typo? The latter is found in The Poissy Antiphonal, but the mode is unclear to me (note that, when the chant continues on the next folio, the F-clef is changed into a C-clef).

    I'm now making a list for Sunday Lauds and Vespers with the chants according to the Ordo Cantus Officii and references to modern chant books (if available). As soon as this list is finished, I'll post it here.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,160
    Francis, many of the hymns have variations in melodies, or completely different melodies, between the two books.

    Also the assignment of office antiphons is sometimes different. For example, the Liber's office for St. Stephen (Dec 26) gives one antiphon for each of the day offices, so you'd sing one antiphon for Lauds, another for Terce, etc., and you'd sing it only before and after the whole set of psalms.

    The Antiphonale lists five antiphons in a row, so you'd use one for each psalm; if there are five psalms, you'd cover them all, and start over when you do the next Hour.
  • Remember that the LotH is not an obligation of the laity. I'm actually considering looking into some medieval offices since there is no restriction that I can discern. If one wanted to implement for parish regular use - in Latin - I would recommend the 1962 Office for consistency with the Mass. I don't feel that there is any need to do the modern LotH in Latin. I would only use this IMO inferior Office if I were required to do it in the vernacular. I recommend Dobzay's chapter on the Office in The Bugnini Liturgy..
  • francis
    Posts: 10,668
    Thanks Chonak. I have used Christian Prayer off and on for years sometimes the Magnificat, and have the four volume set of the LOTH that I inherited from a priest who died, was considering the Mundelein, have the Liber and the universalis on the iPod. I think the Antiphonale may be what I am really after. Has anyone attempted to use this with other lay people interested in the same in a small group setting?

    Is there a side by side English translation of this anywhere to be found?
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,160
    The TLM schola in Boston, Schola Amicorum, sang Vespers from it every week for years during our rehearsals. (Alas, we stopped some years ago.) Like many one-volume office books, it requires a lot of flipping around.
  • dvalerio
    Posts: 341
    > So what is the best immediate solution for singing an authentic LOTH then?

    To the best of my knowledge it surely is Les Heures Grégoriennes (I've linked to the English webpage), already mentioned in some previous comments in this very same thread. It has everything needed to sing all hours (bar the Office of Readings) in Gregorian chant. It is thus a successor of the 1912 Antiphonale (that also lacked Matins). There are also CDs with the melodies recorded. The books even include a vernacular translation for the benefit of those who do not know Latin (alas for you Americans, it's not English, it's French). Of course, it's expensive: 310 US$ (or 195€ if you pay in Euros).
  • francis
    Posts: 10,668
    Dvalerio

    that is very close to a perfect solution except for the fact that it is in French. Thnx. I am going to print the Antiphonale today and begin there.
  • I was looking through my new 1961 breviary, and if I understand the instructions correctly, matins can be anticipated except during Holy Week. I was wondering about having it before midnight mass, say at 10:30. The directions say that it can't be said before the 14th hour of the day. I'm understanding that to be 8 P.M., as 6-7 A.M. is the first hour.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,668
    These eight hours were known by the following names:

    Matins (during the night), sometimes referred to as Vigils or Nocturns, or in monastic usage the Night Office; it is now called the Office of Readings
    Lauds or Dawn Prayer (at Dawn)
    Prime or Early Morning Prayer (First Hour = 6 a.m.)
    Terce or Mid-Morning Prayer (Third Hour = 9 a.m.)
    Sext or Midday Prayer (Sixth Hour = 12 noon)
    None or Mid-Afternoon Prayer (Ninth Hour = 3 p.m.)
    Vespers or Evening Prayer ("at the lighting of the lamps")
    Compline or Night Prayer (before retiring)
    Saint Benedict of Nursia (c. 480 – 543) is credited with having given this organization to the Liturgy of the Hours. However, his scheme was taken from that described by John Cassian, in his two major spiritual works, the Institutes and the Conferences, in which he described the monastic practices of the Desert Fathers of Egypt.
  • dvalerio
    Posts: 341
    > that [Les Heures Grégoriennes] is very close to a perfect solution except for the fact that it is in French. Thnx. I am going to print the Antiphonale today and begin there.

    Yes, quite right. But notice that the 1912 Antiphonale not only lacks many antiphons required by the 1983 Ordo Cantus Officii but also has no translation of the texts into English (or any other vernacular language whatsoever)...
  • francis
    Posts: 10,668
    Dvalerio

    well, the antiphonale is free (except for printing) and I will be no worse off with nothing since French is Greek to me. Once the Les Heures Grégoriennes comes out with English translation I will probably buy it then.
  • If you plan to wait for an English version of the Heures Grégoriennes to appear, I think you may have a long wait. I gather that as the English version of the Divine Office is scheduled to be revised "sometime", an English version of the HG has been postponed sine die, as it is feared it would have a very short lifetime.

    Having used the Heures Grégoriennes for just over a year (admittedly for Lauds and Vespers only), to me the key advantages are firstly that there is full Gregorian Chant for all the day offices, and secondly that it is really simple to use, and (even for a beginner like I) to find one's way around.

    If you want full Offices in English, the Monastic Diurnal / Monastic Diurnal Noted are of course both back in print, and the Briggs and Frere Plainchant Psalter (1902 edition and very easy for congregations to learn) is easily available, and free on the Internet.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,668
    wjcb

    Do you have a link to the free versions!?!? I would really like to see that TODAY and possibly use tomorrow! Took me all last night to set tonight's office.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,160
    Briggs and Frere is in Google Books.

    Some of the BCP Psalm texts don't seem really usable: e.g., Ps. 71, 5: "Through thee have I been holden up ever since I was born..."
  • The Briggs and Frere uses the Church of England's edition of the Coverdale Psalter. Canon Douglas' work the Monastic Diurnal Noted, made use of the US Episcopalian edition of the Coverdale Psalter that smooths out some of the more obscure language. However, the example cited above is easily remedied and rendered as "Through thee have I been upheld ever since I was born..." which to my mind is very beautiful. One also could look at the widely used 1979 Book of Common Prayer Psalter for clarification, and with that reading at 71,6 in mind, one then could render it as Through thee have I been sustained ever since I was born ...

    Both the Coverdale in the 1928 USA BCP edition and the 1979 BCP Psalter are found in our Book of Divine Worship.
  • Laszló Dobszay's "Critical Reflections on the Bugnini Liturgy: The Divine Office" is essential reading. I may be accused of a certain prejudice in this matter since I am a mediaevalist by education, but I do believe the Bride of Christ would be best served by a Book of Hours drafted afresh starting with the texts in use before the Council of Trent. With scholarship like that of Laszló Dobszay and others, surely we can present Holy Church with a new Book of Hours in continuity with our tradition and making use of new technologies to make it available to clergy, religious, and Christ's lay faithful.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,668
    WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is great! Thanks.
  • vincentuher, agreed. Since the laity is not obliged to the 1970 or 1962 forms, we could set up societies that choose any past breviary (well, except Quiñones, which was rejected by Rome). The riches of the Middle Ages cannot be spent in a lifetime.

    Felix nativitatis
  • Most of the Briggs and Frere psalter is on http://sites.google.com/site/wjcbailey/home/plainchant-psalter (in addition to various other locations).
  • This is going to sound dumb, but is Prime really as short as it appears in the LU? There's one antiphon and three psalms with GP, and nothing else. Since I'm really just now looming into possibly doing this, at least some of the hours, Im just trying to make sure I do it correctly. I am intending to sing the hour(s) either privately or publicly, depending on if anyone wishes to participate with me, or if they just happen to be in the church if I'm chanting in there.
  • Protasius
    Posts: 468
    I suggest you look into Sunday Prime first; because the psalms and antiphon and are almost the only things that change, the rest of the hour is only given once. I found this booklet helpful: Learning the New Breviary.
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • You're missing a fair amount, actually. Take a look at (for instance) today's Prime on DivinumOfficium.com and you'll see the hymn, responsory, etc.