Revised Grail and Gelineau tone pairings
  • Earl_GreyEarl_Grey
    Posts: 892
    I have recently been exploring the new Grail Psalter more. Specifically I am referring to the Worship IV companion edition that pairs the psalms with both Gelineau and Guimont psalm tones (which was a good concept). As a singer, I have always enjoyed singing the Gelineau tones and they always seemed to pair very well with the older Grail translation. Now, however I find it very awkward as there are too many syllables per line to comfortably fit them with the Gelineau tone. Technically it works, but it doesn't flow smoothly like it does with the 1963 translation. The new Grail seems to require a non-metrical psalm tone (Conception Abbey, Meinrad, Guimont, Gregorian, etc.) which is sad, because the Gelineau tones were unique and quite meditative. I found them particularly useful for communion processions.
  • CGM
    Posts: 685
    I like the old Gelineau Gradual - as you say, metrical & melodic tones & text.

    I don't believe that the old Grail Psalter has been proscribed for the new Grail, has it?
  • Andrew Motyka
    Posts: 945
    No, it hasn't. I believe that if a psalm translation has been legal in the OF in the past, it's legal now. It's recommended to switch to Revised Grail with new settings, though.

    Earl Grey, interestingly enough both Worship IV and Gather III have the same antiphons settings for their psalmody. However, the W4 verses are set to Gelineau tones and the G3 verses are set to Guimont tones. I thought this to be an interesting decision.
  • ronkrisman
    Posts: 1,390
    Earl Grey, interestingly enough both Worship IV and Gather III have the same antiphons settings for their psalmody. However, the W4 verses are set to Gelineau tones and the G3 verses are set to Guimont tones. I thought this to be an interesting decision.

    Andrew, I must not be understanding what you are saying here. The lectionary section of Gather III has antiphons and psalm tones all written by Michel Guimont. The lectionary section of Worship IV has antiphons composed by a number of composers, even a (very) few by Michel Guimont which also appear in Gather III. All antiphons appear with two psalm tones, one by Joseph Gelineau and one by Michel Guimont.
  • Andrew Motyka
    Posts: 945
    Hmm. I must have missed that nuance while I was just skimming through.

    Edit: actually, scratch that. I was basing what I said on the revised "Lectionary Psalms" by Guimont that I saw at NPM, with Guimont antiphons in both books, but psalm tones that differed in each.
  • ronkrisman
    Posts: 1,390
    @Earl_Grey: You are correct that there are many more lines in The Revised Grail Psalms which have an irregular number of stressed syllables (when compared to the rest of a particular psalm) than are found in the 1963 Grail psalter. This is an unavoidable consequence of having a more literal translation. The Ladies of the Grail at times resorted to paraphrase in order to achieve more regularity in line stresses, the monks of Conception did not.

    That being said, I was surprised to discover during the process of pointing the revised (2010) psalm texts to the Gelineau tones in Worship IV that Fr. Gelineau had himself composed for all possible variations to the number of stressed syllables in each line of his tones.
    Thanked by 1Earl_Grey
  • Earl_GreyEarl_Grey
    Posts: 892
    Yes. It works with the Gelineau as written. I just find myself naturally wanting to add an extra measure at times to avoid so many syllables in a measure.
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    I just recently ordered and received (yesterday) a copy of the new Gelineau/Guimont Lectionary Psalms from GIA. I was pleased to see the names of the composers of the Antiphons: nice to see music by Columba Kelly, and Chrysologus Waddell included.

    I must confess that I prefer the Gelineau tones, but I think the Guimont tones are well constructed, and would be a good stepping stone from more "contemporary" piano-based psalms into chanted psalmody.

    BTW, Fr. Krisman, I really liked your antiphons, especially the one for Christmas.
    Thanked by 1Andrew Motyka
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