Chants Abreges
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    I was looking through the Chants Abreges recently, since I am considering using it with my schola on occasion. It seems to be a very useful collection.

    However, I saw there was a custos at the beginning of most, if not all of the graduals. Now, I can understand it in a situation where you are going directly from one chant to another, like at the beginning of the alleluia or the sequence, where the chants flow directly to each other, more or less without pause. However, the gradual comes after the epistle, not another choir chant, as seen below.

    image

    What is the purpose?
  • ronkrisman
    Posts: 1,394
    Is the custos always on the same line as the clef? If not, could it be related to the mode in some way?
  • ronkrisman
    Posts: 1,394
    Yes, my suspicion was correct. I just checked the PDF of Chants Abrégés.

    The custos is indicating the dominant of the mode:
    1. La
    2. Fa
    3. Do
    4. La
    5. Do
    6. La
    7. Re
    8. Do
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  • jpal
    Posts: 365
    Aha! I have had singers asking me this for two years, and now I can answer intelligently rather than just scratch my head. Of course it never occurred to me to post it here...
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    The custos is indicating the dominant of the mode


    To what purpose?
  • ronkrisman
    Posts: 1,394
    To what purpose?

    That question relates to teleology, which is probably not where Ben wanted to go when he asked his simple question.

    Possible answers (choose one):
    1. To provide satisfaction to singers of chant (perhaps even some members of jpal's schola?) who want, or even need, to be on top of things such as where the dominant is.
    2. To create more work for proofreaders.
    3. To remind singers that God, who is ever caring ("custos"), does not mind the occasional wrong note, if such is performed with a clean heart.
    4. To please the family of the engraver who created the custos font.
    5. To address therapeutically neurotic anal-retentive chant aficionados who need to have everything, even custodes, in their proper place.
    Thanked by 5Salieri Adam Wood jpal SkirpR Heath
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    5. To address therapeutically neurotic anal-retentive chant aficionados who need to have everything, even custodes, in their proper place.


    I didn't know you knew me!
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  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    All fun aside, the "dominant" of a mode is also known as the "reciting tone" or "tenor" of that mode, indicating the principal tone around which the chant revolves and the reciting (repeated) tone of the associated psalm tone. This is the tone which, often, would be in the singer's mind when chanting. Traditionally, the reciting tone was a perfect fifth above the final for the authentic modes (1,3,5,7) and a third above final for the plagal modes (2,4,6,8); however, the dominants for modes 3, 4, and 8 rose a step about a thousand years ago to the values given in the list.
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  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    In reading The Page Book, there is a mention that during the Franco-Roman period of development, and especially after the invention of the staff, that melodies began to "gel" around conceptions of tonic and dominant, suggesting (if I read it right, and remember correctly) either the use of an audible drone or at least an internal (to the singer) conception of a drone.

    I'm wondering if there is a connection, even remote, between these two things. For example: might the custos indicate to someone (a Bass singer, a serpent player) what note to play/sing as a drone or ison? Or indicate what pitch an organum ought to begin on? Or be some vestigial remnant of some version of one of those ideas? Or (and this was the crux of my question) in some way or another have (or be vestigial reference to) some practical purpose and not simply a theoretical one?
  • Chrism
    Posts: 872
    It helps in setting the pitch. The dominant of the mode is also the resting note of the Psalm tone, which needs to be a comfortable pitch, and according to some theories is typically set to A=440.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    It helps in setting the pitch. The dominant of the mode is also the resting note of the Psalm tone,

    So if you had been listening to the Psalm tone, it would be easier to find the beginning of the antiphon here? That makes sense.

    according to some theories is typically set to A=440

    well.. that seems unlikely.
    But the other part seems reasonable.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    I meant -
    A=440 seems unlikely to be true, BTW. It seems perfectly likely that some theorist would say ridiculous things.
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  • Chrism
    Posts: 872
    So if you had been listening to the Psalm tone


    Apparently, there are some monasteries with a tuning device, often set to 440. Or, alternatively, you can auralize the most comfortable note.
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    So if you had been listening to the Psalm tone, it would be easier to find the beginning of the antiphon here? That makes sense.


    I actually do that often when learning new chants. The psalm tone is easy to sing, and you get the "sound" in your thread before you learn the antiphon. It often helps me.
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  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    Interesting discussion!
  • ronkrisman
    Posts: 1,394
    It helps in setting the pitch. The dominant of the mode is also the resting note of the Psalm tone

    So what Chrism suggests would serve a practical purpose, Adam. But why hasn't any other chant collection followed the example of Chant Abrégés and included this manner of indicating the dominant/reciting tone/tenor?
  • SkirpRSkirpR
    Posts: 854
    But why hasn't any other chant collection followed the example of Chant Abrégés and included this manner of indicating the dominant/reciting tone/tenor?


    Perhaps because the Chant Abreges was in a ways the precursor to the Graduale Simplex, and the editors assumed this extra assistance would be helpful to those who would be using the book. If you're using one of the "grown-up" chant books, perhaps it was assumed you knew how to find the dominant.

    Like how beginner piano books have the pitch names inside the noteheads, but... you know... most music doesn't.
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    Like how beginner piano books have the pitch names inside the noteheads


    Ahh...those were the days.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    Like how beginner piano books have the pitch names inside the noteheads, but... you know... most music doesn't.


    It doesn't?

    All my piano music does. Along with numbers to tell you which finger to use.

    How do you read this music that doesn't tell you the pitch names? Are you supposed to have the whole melody memorized? Are the un-lettered notes just there to remind you of the contour and rhythm?

    This is so confusing....
  • SkirpRSkirpR
    Posts: 854
    This is so confusing....


    Confusing is what happens to my singers when I sing a mode V or VI chant in solfege but sing all the FAs as DO, SOs as RE, LAs as MI, TEs and FA, TIs and FI, and so on...

    I can't help it, I learned modern music first.
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  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    It would be so much easier if we didn't have to worry about all these different notes, and could just sing the Propers on a single pitch. Maybe someone could put together a resource to show how to do that....
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  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,193
    Confusing is what happens to my singers when I sing a mode V or VI chant in solfege but sing all the FAs as DO, SOs as RE, LAs as MI, TEs and FA, TIs and FI, and so on...

    I can't help it, I learned modern music first.
    I hear you ... and I hear you.
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