Psalm Tones besides the usual ones?
  • ClemensRomanusClemensRomanus
    Posts: 1,023
    What other psalm tones are there besides the 8 tones, peregrinus, in directum, Paschal Nunc dimittis, and ad Commemoration of the Faithful departed (mentioned in the 1912 Antiphonale Romanum)? I've seen Tone D d, but are there others in the Antiphonale Romanum II or elsewhere?
  • smvanroodesmvanroode
    Posts: 987
    The Antiphonale Monasticum I (2005) also has II* (former IV A or quartus modus alteratus), IV*, C (former tonus in directum), D and E (former tonus irregularis).
  • In the back of St Dunstan's Plainsong Psalter there is a table of all the eight tones + peregrinus and their various cadences, which in the case of several of the tones includes the addition of cadences peculiar to York, Gisburn, Worcester, Peterborough, and several others. One might suppose that there are similar variations that are/were peculiar to local uses and monastic houses on the continent as well as England. The table in this psalter also includes a number of 'irregular tones'. For those unfamiliar with this book, it is well worth having and is available from the Lancelot Andrewes Press. It is a complete Coverdale psalter pointed for singing in all the various tones, plus canticles and other items. (Square notes, too.)
  • ClemensRomanusClemensRomanus
    Posts: 1,023
    Very cool. Would it be possible to get a copy of these alternate tones in the Antiphonale Monasticum? Thank you.
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 3,177
    Some one gave me a book (a very old, water-damaged, moldy book, which he is now photocopying and putting in a binder for me), with accompaniments for the psalm-tones. It is mensuralist, and I think was published around 1880 or so. It includes the 8 tones + Peregrinus with all of the Variant mediants and conclusions; this includes variants from the Parisian tradition and some others -- including the 'Ton Royale' variant of mode VI. When I get it, I'll see if I can scan it and post it here.
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  • ClemensRomanusClemensRomanus
    Posts: 1,023
    Very cool!
  • ClemensRomanusClemensRomanus
    Posts: 1,023
    @smvanroode,

    Do you have tones II*, IV*, C, D, and E? I'm trying to make a small booklet of common tones for my Schola. Thanks.

    @MJO,

    Thanks for the info. I've had the St. Dunstan's on my Amazon wishlist, but just haven't been able to get it yet.

    @Salieri,

    That would be much appreciated.


    Thanks to all of you for the information and help!
  • smvanroodesmvanroode
    Posts: 987
    Here they are:
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  • ClemensRomanusClemensRomanus
    Posts: 1,023
    Cool, thanks!
  • ClemensRomanusClemensRomanus
    Posts: 1,023
    How do you get the 2 clefs in Tone D in Gregorio?
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    more of a newbie question: why the 2 clefs? Isn't one good enough? :)

    Seriously though, what's the purpose?
  • ClemensRomanusClemensRomanus
    Posts: 1,023
    Transpositions, I think.
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    huh? I thought chant pitch is relative, making transpositions pointless.
  • Transpositions, yes.
    One will note that the 'D' mode results from the pitches as placed relative to either clef.
    One is for the Tonus Superior and the other is for the Tonus Substratum.
    One has never before seen such an example of chant with two clefs.
    One wonders, along with BY, if one clef isn't enough and two pointless.
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    Or is it something like the gospel tone, where changing the clef can switch from the solemn to simple tone....
  • tomjaw
    Posts: 2,749
    The Psalmorum, has at least one psalm with two clefs, it appears to be used for more than one Communion.

    I think someone was trying to be helpful!
  • SkirpRSkirpR
    Posts: 854
    Yes, the two clefs are for transposition, but you're all over-complicating it.

    Depends on where the clef used for the antiphon... For example, in the case of Mode D, some set you up (based on the Euouae given) for the clef on the top line (psalmtone incipit starting on SO), others set you up (again based on the Euouae given) for the clef on the second line (psalmtone incipit starting on RE).

    You'll notice in either case the intervals between the pitches of the psalmtone would be the same. Ben, this is the principle of transposition in chant - taken out of context of an antiphon, RE DO RE MI RE, sounds exacatly the same as SO FA SO LA SO.

    This carries through to the terminations. Mode D d ends on RE (when reading using the lower clef), while Mode D g ends on SO (when reading using the upper clef), and so on for the other two terminations. Again, D d and D g sound the same, but are different relative to the antiphon.

    Make sense?
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  • SkirpRSkirpR
    Posts: 854
    One wonders, along with BY, if one clef isn't enough and two pointless.


    Perhaps I should also clarify that nowhere in the Antiphonales of Solesmes of the past decade (or any other modern Solesmes books) have I seen antiphons using two clefs. This is just short-hand in the psalmtone guide in the back of the book to show that either situation may arise.
  • SkirpRSkirpR
    Posts: 854
    And not to belabor the point, but with an eye toward providing helpful information for lurkers:

    It's also important to remember that while many may be most accustomed to hearing psalmtones employed as a vehicle of delivery for the Propers of the Mass, this is a fairly recent development. Their original purpose was to provide a vehicle for chanting psalms or canticles under antiphons of the Divine Office. The solemn psalmtones serve the same purpose for the Mass. A psalmtone without an antiphon seems to me to historically have been a pretty novel idea (except for special 'in directum' psalmtones which serve that purpose in situations where no antiphon is employed).

    While not an unworthy employ of their use, it is not without some musical difficulty that psalmtones be employed to replace an antiphon of the same mode, for example, the common practice of setting, say, an Introit to a psalmtone. While the psalmtones of a given mode complement the antiphons of that mode, I would argue in some cases the musical effect is completely different. Compare the effect of a Mode I antiphon (ending on RE, sounding minor), with most of the Mode I psalmtones, which almost never end on RE. A very common termination, Mode I f, ends on FA and sounds major - likely much different from the final cadence of the antiphon it would be replacing.

    I'm not decrying the practice of substituting psalmtones as some terrible musical occrence - especially if thats all you or your group can pull off well for a Missa Cantata - just pointing out that its not inherent to the development of psalmtones.
  • ClemensRomanusClemensRomanus
    Posts: 1,023
    Very true, Skirp.
  • This book from the French Oratory contains, besides some cool litanies, 4 unique psalm tones.
    640 x 1136 - 125K
    640 x 1136 - 94K
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  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,187
    The link on "This book" leads to a Google permission error.
  • Interesting. It worked when I tested it. I'll try it again.
  • Does it work now?
    In any case the book is "Cantus Varii ad Usum Congregationis Oratorii Domini Jesu et Mariae Immaculatae.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,187
    Yes, it's fine now; thanks for checking.