Agustoni, the ictus, and "value"
  • incantuincantu
    Posts: 989
    Spinning off a recently resurrected thread about the ictus (and, later, Cardine's theories of value), I'd like to share a recording of Luigi Agustoni directing the Nova Schola Gregoriana alongside a performance of my amateur church choir, with nary an ictus to be found in either.

    Listen for yourself on the chant blog at euouae.com.

    These two independent performances do differ slightly, but I would argue that the differences are mostly in performance style, and not in the fundamental reading of the text.
  • RobertRobert
    Posts: 343
    Your choir is excellent and reminds me of the Gloria Dei Cantores schola--absolutely remarkable for an amateur parish choir. I am very jealous.
  • incantuincantu
    Posts: 989
    Thank you! Of course, this particular performance does not represent my ideal (the unintentional accent on "SpiriTUS," the stuttering apostrophes, to give but two examples), but I do think it demonstrates that a semiologically informed approach can be used with untrained singers. And without the ictus.

    How do you think the two readings of the text compare?
  • RobertRobert
    Posts: 343
    Yes, they are very similar. I would say that particularly in the final three alleluias you draw out some of the lengthened notes more than Agustoni does, such as the tenete on "lu." Also he treats the neumatic cut at the beginning of the second alleluia in a way that makes the first note preceding the cut as a springboard, whereas you indicate its importance by a lengthening. This is what I hear anyway and maybe this is really more of a performance difference than a significant difference in how you are reading it. Agustoni is also evidently looking at Laon (e.g. he has a pes over the second syllable of "replevit," and I also think he is taking rhythmic cues in places.) Not sure how much you were consulting Laon here, in some spots such as the cadential torculus it seems like you might be.

    I think this recording is from the 70s, the early days of the NSG, and I would be interested to hear what the vastly improved NSG of the 90s under Turco would have done with it. No slight against the master (Agustoni) but I think Turco had better singers at his disposal who were more capable of executing the director's vision. This take seems a little granular, analytical, neume-y if you know what I mean, maybe a little fussy for my tastes. In some ways your choir's performance succeeds at achieving something more holistic.
  • JennyH
    Posts: 106
    What I like about it is that the 'longs and shorts' are clearly articulated in the YouTube recording. One can almost hear the brevis, semi-brevis, longa, etc. Bravo.
  • incantuincantu
    Posts: 989
    We were using the Triplex for this recording (since the GN was not yet available) so I was able consult Laon for the interpretation of the cadential torculus -- which I generally take as convention, whether the printed notation makes it explicit or not.

    I followed St. Gall for some of the melodic variants, which mostly occur when there is a voiced consonant followed by a unison pitch which I treat as an "initial liquescent" or "weak initial note," such as results when untrained singers scoop up to a higher pitch.

    There are some great recordings of Turco on the Naxos label. I agree that Agustoni's performance here is a little bit stilted. I think a lot of the more recent semiological performances are still heavily influenced by the aesthetic of Solesmes, if not its rhythmic theories. That is, interpreters still have an idea of what chant is "supposed" to sound like, which they have tempered or updated with the fruits of the most recent research. It's remarkable that Agustoni was able to depart from that norm so much in the 1970's. I'm working mostly with singers who did not have a Solesmes background, so it's in many ways easier to cultivate a different idea of "normal."
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