Auditioning a choir each year is a VERY important thing to do.

I strongly agree with this - even if everyone gets in.

The larger a choir is, the less comfortable I am assigning voices in divisi sections unless I really have some sense for each singer's individual voice, which I can only get with some one-on-one time hearing them sing.

btodorovich - That sounds like a good plan... Just make certain you take steps to make sure that the non-auditioned group never feels like the ugly step-child of the auditioned group.

It must be nice to have the luxury of choosing only the best voices for a choir. My choir is volunteer only, with no paid singers. I appreciate and will work with what I get. If I auditioned, I might have 6 people left.

I know of one local parish that no longer has a choir because the director wanted only the best voices. He got them, and everyone else left. He's gone, too. That parish now has only a paid cantor.

Depends on your situation. If you have paid section leaders and are at a cathedral, yea, i might do a yearly tryout, etc. But a parish with 10 choir members in a small town, I think not. Situation by situation. Never a blanket approach.

I sang in a parish choir for a while whose director based his audition process on the need for balance among the voices. He started with 16 "places," four per voice, SATB. Of course the soprano places filled up immediately. He then explained that more soprano places would open up as soon as he had four of each of the other voices. So he could do a certain amount of auditioning and selecting based on balance. He improved the sound and skills of the choir members so much that I don't think he got a lot of flack for auditioning singers for a "place."

I audition people for the choir. I don't re-audition though. Once you are in, (unless there is some problem) you are in. That being said, the audition is not strenuous.

This process resulted from when I did not audition members, and I let a tenor join who could not sing. It was terrible. I think he had a learning disability, but he could not read in rhythm and could not sound out Latin words. My best tenor threatened to quit (or throw the poor new guy over the loft) if I didn't ask him to leave. So, I kindly told him that his skills needed work; he needed private lessons that I could not provide in a group setting. I gave him the names of a couple of good teachers and told him to get six months of lessons and come back to re-audition. He never returned.

But from then on, I've held auditions. If the person can't sing (they don't have to read, just match pitches and sing a scale and a hymn tune on their own) I ask them to get six months of lessons, so that they can feel as if they are contributing to the group, and come back. No one has taken me up on the offer.

It is simply frustrating enough to work with people who cannot read music, let alone those who cannot match a pitch or have no sense of rhythm.

There isn't a "one size fits all" solution here. It's about the culture of the parish.

I was reflecting on the culture at my parish, and I came to a conclusion. The problem is this concept of "beautiful voices": "His voice is beautiful, her voice is so beautiful, mine is ugly. I can't sing." People believe that the capacity to make a musical tone is something that a very select few have, rather than a natural skill everyone can develop. I remember a student forum with a world-famous opera singer. A jazz major said "Why do you sound so unnatural when you sing?" The singer became immediately offended and rebutted, "That IS a natural sound. And you can sound just like that, too!"

To people who think like this, the audition process says "There are people who can sing well and people who can't - and we will expose anyone in the latter category." I get Noel's point, and it's a good one: show people that THEY CAN SING! I also know that if I instituted such a policy at my church, my choir would consist of two people. Not hyperbole. I know which two people. Good people. But I need more than them. At some churches, however, this strategy would be a triumph.

Discern what your community (yes, I said "community", get over yourselves) needs to encourage people to step forward. In my "pitches", I recently began phrasing it, "If you can follow directions, want to learn, and can make a commitment, consider choir." I got three new members. As Charles in CenCA says, YMMV.

Everyone here has a valid point. A parish choir needs to have high standards to attract the better musicians in the parish - (and it will also attract the better musicians from other parishes....without any malicious intent...it just happens as we all know.) One size doesn't fit all and auditions (strictly speaking) can be intimidating and keep people away.

On the other hand, and this is obviously Noel's intent (at least I think so) there has to be some way to assess and assign the parish talent; challenge the better musicians and nurture the parishioners who need some - or a lot - of help.

My personal self-imposed rule is that no one in a parish who wants to be pray via sung prayer can be denied that experience. I take everyone - and yeah, I often regret it, but I don't personally have the heart to turn anyone away - unless they become divisive and consistently work against the choral "good." (But usually those people go away on their own.)

So - how do we develop decent choirs and include all?
Three things can achieve this (in my humble opinion)

1. Choral Assessments (instead of auditions)
2. Referrals to voice teachers or holding a group voice classes
3. A parish "choir school"

It's fairly straightforward. I do have auditions, but I don't call them auditions. I call them "vocal assessments" (or placements as Andrew noted above.) I agree that it is extremely important for the director to have a chance to hear all voices in private in a nurturing, calm environment.

In the past, I've organized a "choir informational meet and greet" where I:

a. Explain my choral approach and what I expect of choir members. At one point I typed up a list of "Choir Etiquette" which was very helpful (no talking while one section is working on something, etc.)
b. Give out some information about the documents on sacred music and rubrics.
c. Explain how I run rehearsals and what each member is responsible for bringing (pencils, water, etc.)
d. Give out a handout on basic score marking and basic music theory (staff, clefs, etc.)
e. Have sign up sheets for a personal vocal assessment which will be scheduled on one or two nights before rehearsals start.
f. Eat cookies and refreshments with everyone and play some beautiful choral music on a Bose CD player.
Then on another night - or that night if things go quickly - I hold individual vocal assessments and everyone leaves the assessment with a form telling them what their range is, where their passagio is in their range and what they should work on in order to get the most out of the choral work they will be doing that year.

Here's a bulleting announcement that has worked:

"The "St. Cecilia Parish Choir" is now forming and is open to anyone who would like to participate. "Maurice Durufle, our Director of Music will be holding an informal informational meet and greet (with refreshments) on Wed. Sept. 10. At the meeting you will be able to hear about the great plans Maurice has for the choir(s) this year and sign up for a free vocal assessment. The vocal assessment is a short, five-ten minute private appointment with Maurice so that he can get to know you and your voice. This is informal - SO NO NEED TO BE NERVOUS. But this will allow him to:

1. Get to know you on a one to one basis and assess your vocal range - in order to be certain that each member is assigned to the proper choral section; Soprano, Alto, Tenor, Bass. Singing music that is not in your vocal range can lead to vocal strain and damage and no one wants that!
2. Discuss any concerns you may have as well as your musical goals for the choir season.
3. Give you a personal assessment, outlining your strengths and areas that could be improved in your vocal/ choral skills. Mr. Durufle will make some simple recommendations on how you can improve your skills and meet the goals for the coming season.
4. You will also have a chance to discuss your options if you would like to take your vocal studies farther. Maurice will have information on area voice teachers that he recommends.

You know, something along these lines that gives the Director a one on one with the choir member. All the above is true and very helpful.

Lastly - my new thing is that I'm going to create a little "Parish Choir School" to run in the summer or whatever seems convenient. I think this is something that is long overdue and has always been a pipe dream of mine. It can be done fairly economically, I think.
Offer a different "fundamentals of music" classes that can run for a few nights or a few weeks during the summer - whatever. Bring in qualified friends (or teach classes yourself) on ear training, pitch matching, sight singing, music reading, theory, reading neumes or whatever. Charge a minimal fee that your choir members can afford - and all the money goes to pay the teacher. The parish should pick up the cost of the materials, if possible.

Love to know your thoughts, but don't beat me up, ok? I'm a sensitive musician type.

P.s. I can't imagine Noel going to all the trouble of having the brilliant idea of publishing the Catholic Choir Book et al. so that even the average parish musician can have a chance to develop the skill to eventually sing polyphony -- and then having any success at keeping anyone out of his parish choir. (Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're all saying the same thing in a different way....pretty much.) Men.

I agree that if you don't foster an atmosphere of seriousness then you get what you deserve. I'm not advocating that at all. But I think part of our responsibility is to teach that air of seriousness in a variety of ways. Sometimes gently, but mostlyin a kind and business-like fashion. And while I'd love to have a choir that can walk in and read most anything, blend, breathe correctly etc. - that's not going to happen right away.

Perhaps, I'm an idealist, and I am, I know. But my experience has taught me that it can happen in time. My high school girls know better than to approach our service to mass without seriousness, focus, bringing their whole beings into conformity with the liturgy. I demand it of them. But I have had to take a hand in their formation - both spiritual and musically.

But, I won't suffer fools after I've given them a chance. I recently found a way to jettison a young girl who was being divisive, even though she had a beautiful voice. And she's not coming back until she learns some humility.

I think it has a lot to do with how we lead and how that leadership translates into service.
For my part, there is more to it than just perfect execution. I've seen perfect execution at the Kennedy center and loathed the concert because the performers could not get out of the way of their own egos.

Can we just be concerned with how beautiful we sound? I'm asking in ernest with all due respect to everyone of you on this forum, who have sacrificed countless hours, money and God knows what else?

I don't think we can. I think our business is to care for the souls of those God puts before us. Demand excellence. Strive for it. I never stop and I'm not advocating mediocrity because I personally don't want any part of that.

But, I've seen so much true conversion in my choirs. I hesitate to describe it because it has little to do with me and everything to do with the Holy Spirit ordering things around me - often in my confusion. But within the confines of an adult choir that I was directing, I've seen a grown man come back to the Church and go through confirmation because his parents hadn't bothered, a couple get re-married in the church after going through a long annulment process that they hadn't wanted to deal with, a husband invite his wife to join the choir, then have their teenage daughters join so that the whole family started going back to mass every Sunday, and more. One 12 year old girl singing in my Catholic school Honors Choir who had no religious affiliation, was so struck by grace during a memorial mass we were doing for a teenage boy that had been killed in a car accident, that she asked to come into the church and eventually, her mother followed. I was privileged to see it happen as I was directing.

The teenage boy was my 18 yr. old son, Thomas. My beautiful, amateur choir sang like angels at his funeral under the direction of my dear friend and the best musician I know, Chris Candela. People that hadn't been to church in years, had never been to a Catholic church at all and people who didn't know anything about music were swept away by the love, passion and yes, excellence with which they executed every sublime piece. There were 3000 people at the funeral and 22 priests on the altar. There were many, many conversions that day because of the transcendence of the music - the precision of the liturgy handled with love and reverence by the shocked and saddened priest and friends, and the raw heartbreaking tragedy - that God used for His own purposes for eventual good.

Anyway, if all we are after is musical perfection and we're willing to cast aside whomever cannot conform, I want no part of it. I think we can have it all. Why can't we?

I leave you with this thought from C.S. Lewis in the Weight of Glory; "There are no ordinary people....it is immortals whom we joke with, work with, marry, snub and exploit. ......Meanwhile the cross comes before the crown and tomorrow is a Monday morning. A cleft has opened in the pitiless walls of the world, and we are invited to follow our great Captain inside. The following Him is, of course, the essential point."

In boundless respect for all....

Our parish began completely rebuilding the music program almost two years ago, when the current pastor hired a new music director (yours truly), and most of those involved in music quit for one of two reasons: (a) they didn't like the "new direction"; (b) they were loyal to the previous leaders.

We started three new choirs, each with a different character (and singing at different Masses), none of them requiring auditions. I definitely did not have the luxury of auditions. I don't know if we will ever have auditions. But now we are developing levels within the choir, so that if you reach a certain level of proficiency, you can sing additional things (parts to hymns, choral music, etc.). The objective standard for most people will be progression in the Voice for Life series. I have a couple paid singers as well, and they are recognized as leaders.

Advantages are the following: it allows me to accept anyone, it allows the choir to sing more difficult repertoire without just programming to the lowest common denominator, and it gives those with lesser skills more motivation to improve because they see and hear the more difficult and more beautiful repertoire, and think "I want to be in on that." Or, if they are happy just sitting with the choir and singing pretty much what the congregation sings, while acquiring the most basic vocal and musical skills in rehearsal, that's perfectly fine too.

I have had some singers voluntarily drop out because they realized that they were over their head. I have not yet had to ask anyone to leave.

We will see how it goes! I am still relatively new at this and have made a lot of mistakes.

Jon