Roman Catholic Music Partnering (RCMP)
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    I am rolling something around in my brain and am wondering what you think. How many of you would subscribe? Are you a Church? Are you a musician?

    If you want to reply in private, either whisper or email me below.

    This would be a new service to the Church that magnetizes those who support authentic RC Sacred Music. It goes like this:

    Roman Catholic Music Partnering

    Seeking: Roman Catholic Churches and musicians of like mind, both who subscribe to the RCMP constitution. The purpose of RCMP is to match potential qualified Catholic choirmasters, organists and composers to respective Churches.

    RCMP Constitution

    All partners are practicing devoted Roman Catholics and uphold and promote the longstanding tradition of organ music, Gregorian Chant and sacred polyphony. We uphold and promote the Vatican documents on sacred music. We desire to see the increased practice of Pope Benedict's Summorum Pontificum and the promotion of the Extraordinary Form as much as possible. We wish to educate those who are willing to learn about the true nature of sacred music in the liturgy, the use of Propers and the role of celebrant, schola, choir and congregation in their repsective parts.

    Churches and musicians that promote liturgies in the use of piano and guitar music will not be considered.

    Contact francis@RomanCatholicSacredMusic.com if you are interested.
  • I think that we should also add following Sacramentum Caritatis No. 42 to the organization's constitution:

    Liturgical song

    42. In the ars celebrandi, liturgical song has a pre-eminent place. (126) Saint Augustine rightly says in a famous sermon that "the new man sings a new song. Singing is an expression of joy and, if we consider the matter, an expression of love" (127). The People of God assembled for the liturgy sings the praises of God. In the course of her two-thousand-year history, the Church has created, and still creates, music and songs which represent a rich patrimony of faith and love. This heritage must not be lost. Certainly as far as the liturgy is concerned, we cannot say that one song is as good as another. Generic improvisation or the introduction of musical genres which fail to respect the meaning of the liturgy should be avoided. As an element of the liturgy, song should be well integrated into the overall celebration (128). Consequently everything -- texts, music, execution -- ought to correspond to the meaning of the mystery being celebrated, the structure of the rite and the liturgical seasons (129). Finally, while respecting various styles and different and highly praiseworthy traditions, I desire, in accordance with the request advanced by the Synod Fathers, that Gregorian chant be suitably esteemed and employed (130) as the chant proper to the Roman liturgy (131).
  • I'm in.

    Great idea.
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    I'm very interested in and would like to know specifics. (sorry I think I posted it in a wrong thread)
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    Well, this is certainly a needed resource. It really does not aspire to be another CMAA, but more like a guild of musicians and Churches (more likely specific clergymen) that all agree on the very basics of what sacred music is as defined by Rome in her official documents, and then living that out in our situations as best as possible and supporting each other in it.

    I suspect that everyone who is interested in this is already a member of CMAA, but our purpose would be to network with those who are focused on the three elements of sacred music, and ONLY those elements:

    1. Gregorian Chant
    2. Polyphony
    3. Organ Music

    Of course, there is the new element of vernacular plainchant, polyphony and organ composition also, but these MUST follow in the tradition that Benedictgal has pointed out in number 42 of Sacramentum Caritatis and take root naturally in the elements of sacred music of the Roman Rite. Therefore resources like the SEP or the Vatican II Hymnal and the Lumen Christi Missal could also be a part of the purview. But it is important to note that we do not aspire to be inclusive of guitar and/or piano based music, so resources that include that type of philosophy would not be welcome.

    Step one is building the network of churches and musicians who subscribe to that ideal, and LIVE it!

    I will probably launch a new section of my website with a tab for this effort, a place we can sign up, and begin to share ideas, etc.

    How does that sound?
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    NOTE: I am getting whispers and emails on this. So there is a considerable interest.
  • G
    Posts: 1,401
    I am certain there are many such as I, who would be thrilled to find a pastor and parish where they would be welcome even as as a chorister.

    (Save the Liturgy, Save the World)
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    UPDATE:

    As I get more input from more people, it becomes clear to me that we should compose a musical creed of the RCMP. I was calling it a Constitution, but a creed would be a personal statement that each of us are willing to make in a united voice. It will gather some of what is above, but we will also add to it what we believe to be fitting music of the liturgy concerning hymns, what a hymn is, how is should be defined, weighed and approved as concerns the Roman Catholic liturgy. This means that everything that is included in the liturgy that does not fall into the category of GC or polyphony is presently considered a hymn that requires some kind of vetting. This applies to texts, tunes and styles.

    The past fifty years since VII has been an experimental time for liturgical music, and we have gained great clarity about what does and what does not belong. We want to begin the process of reigning in those things that are questionable and remove those things that are inappropriate. Let's face it square on. As the Entrance, Offertory and Communion Propers are re-established as the norm in their respective places, hymns will most likely find their rightful place.

    Of course it will meet the challenges on a day to day basis, person by person with respect to each of our own situations, but we will find support in comradarie, encouragement and perhaps begin to form a voice that can make a difference in this exciting new time in the reform of the liturgy.

    The Church clearly upholds and promotes GC, polyphony and the organ, but hymnody has been the novelty of the past century or more, and it has made a huge impact on our liturgies. It has taken our liturgies by storm and diminished the role of those things that deserve the primacy of place, and this truly needs to be addressed by those who will stand up and give voice to the same.

    The idea is not to eliminate hymns from the liturgy, but that we would promote and uphold the model of hymnody that DOES belong and how it belongs.

    On another thread, we have been debating as to what is the meaning of the word "hymn" as it applies to the Roman Catholic Liturgy. We are not concerned with the world definition, the use of 'hymns' in other churches or as defined by the global musical community. We only want to bring clarity and sound reason to those hymns that belong in our own Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,220
    Francis: I'm afraid that abbreviation is already occupied!
  • RC, I was joking with a mutual friend about that in a conversation last week! "They always get their man!" And I'm sure there's software that one of us has that could reconfigure clips of Nelson Eddy and Jeanette McDonald so that they're not singing "You-hoo hoo hoo," but "Ego sum panis vivus." ;-)
    "Partnering" might also be one of those unfortunately misconnotated terms in this era as well.
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,198
    The RCMP - they always get their man!
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    No problem. The name is not important, the purpose is what matters. We can come up with a better name. Idea?
  • Kathy
    Posts: 5,513
    How about the Church Music Association of America?
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,220
    reconfigure clips of Nelson Eddy and Jeanette McDonald so that they're not singing "You-hoo hoo hoo,"


    Isn't that "Indian Love Call" ("When I'm calling you...")? As long as they aren't singing the other "yoo-hoo song" ("You who dwell...")
  • No, it's not.

    There are a wide variety of people with differing ideas and criteria for liturgical music here, just as there are chant people who belong to NPM.

    We know what people who advertise for a new musician by saying, "Must belong to NPM." but I am not quite sure that everyone on this list would have as strict and limited view of what music should be....
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    FNJ

    You typed it faster than I could. It will be more like a guild, with specific focus on what the Church holds as the highest ideal without compromise or creative innovation (to the structure of the liturgy). New composition (chant, polyphony and organ) would be encouraged, but finding its roots in the patronage of sacred music RC. Maybe we should be the Summorum Pontificates (tic).

    I have received emails and whispers that people are definitely interested in this. We have to make sure it is forged correctly and in the right spirit under the guidance of the Holy Spirit so that it promotes all that is true and noble in accordance with all the precepts of Holy Mother Church.

    We waste a lot of time here debating what the Church has already stated are its wishes. (Sometimes I wonder if JT started his blog for similar reasons.) This org would be intent on getting on with the business of BEING AND DOING exactly what the Church desires in terms of sacred music. Anyone can join CMAA. This membership seeks out those who believe and try to live out the same ideal.

    Not unlike a third order I suspect.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    I think there is a need for another organization, but I'm not sure you're describing the right one.

    So far, it sounds like you're describing CMAA, except- you know- we won't have any people like Adam Wood and Charles Culbreth hang around because they both like Ed Bolduc's new Mass setting.

    There's also a big need for an organization like Corpus Christi Watershed. I wonder if anyone has thought of starting something like that. Oh yeah... it's called Corpus Christi Watershed.

    I'm also kind of reminded of this...
    http://xkcd.com/927/

    ---

    What I THINK might be helpful is a publishing and marketing cooperative, built to design, publish, package, and market Sacred Music resources in a way that people not currently using those resources, or not quite as online/free-resouirce/PD/CC-savvy, can get access to them.

    Primary Goal:
    Get more people singing better music.

    Secondary Goal:
    Provide an opportunity for composers, arrangers, transcriptionists, engravers, and Sacred Musicians to promote their work and maybe make a little income.


    That's my opinion.
    (And something I would like to be involved in).
  • Good friend, Adam, as well as all good CMAA friends,
    POV regarding your comments:
    CMAA is my final stop on the guild track of my life. I think the most important word of those four initials is the third one, "association." I have chosen, "like" it or not, to associate with folks whose passion, work, and vision, for the larger part, aligns with mine as regards "church music."
    As far as organizations come and go, I thank God that He led me to bind myself to the only human corporate enterprise that, for my soul, matters supremely for the care and well being of that soul: the RCC.
    As I understand it, there are two qualifications to be a member of this organization: 1. To love God above all; 2. To love others as if they were myself (to the point of giving up my life, if necessary.) That's it.
    Last big existential point: even tho' understanding all this can appear to be convoluted at times, it seems to me that "builiding up" trumps "tearing down" in this organization. It seems to me that communion trumps division, tho' achieving that here will ever remain elusive. I don't believe these values are "wishy washy' or bespeak a casual, cafeteria-style philosophy. They're simple principles.
    Charles Culbreth will hang around CMAA as long as CMAA will have me. That doesn't mean knowing there's some secret decoder ring we all must wear, or that occasionally breaking ranks on matters of import is a dealbreaker and I return the ring.
    My appreciation for this Mass setting, or that one, for this hymn and not that one, for this ritual expression versus another, is prefaced upon whether they measure up to those two qualifications I mention above as I understand the equation. If other members of the overarching organization above our guild think that's verboten, they will bring that to my attention directly; not by insinuation, or presumptions about my "association" with other people or liturgical attributes. And we'll figure it out together.
    If I were to believe that by joining the Diners Club or Platinum Frequent Flyers niche was of any, much less paramount concern to my soul's esteem or of any benefit at all, I will have then ex-communicated myself from that one organization that really matters- the one that really holds the keys.
    Thank you for your consideration.
  • I like the idea...but I'm somewhat concerned about too much splintering. We've got the Corpus Christi Watershed....then we have the CMAA...then Adoremus.....I think one of the big reasons the "other group" has been so successful (other than being supported by the bishops) is because it is basically the only one of its kind. If something like this is formed, I'd really like it to be spawned out of the CMAA. I'd like to see the CMAA rise up and start to rival the other organization for membership, offerings, etc. I think the thing to do is offer this sort of service under the auspices of the CMAA.

    Another concern is that, I assume, this would require dues. I know the organizations don't necessarily charge large dues, but as a DoM who is also a teacher in the parish school, I have my dues for CMAA, my dues for AGO, my dues for ACDA, my dues for MENC....I think these are all separate and all serve different purposes...but to add another organization on top of hundreds of dollars in dues that I already pay...it means I'll either have to start picking and choosing, or start having to pick up the tab on my own (some of which I already do).

    Like I said, I love the idea...but I just think it isn't something we need a whole new group to do. That said, if it were to take off, I'll jump on the bandwagon.

    Adam S.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    Not about money... no dues... not about publishing... not educational nor resources (CMAA already does this very well, and so does CCWS)... strictly a group who believe, pray and stay on track... musicians and clergy who are one in mind. Thats it! Quite simple! So if a musician looking for a church that wants JUST THIS, gets one!

    Likewise, the Church who wants one of these musicians, WILL NOT promote guitars, drums or sacro pop of any kind. These would be the "progressive" (returning to our roots... that is the new movement of today) musicians who utilize the Graduale, Simplex, PBC, VII Hymnal, Lumen Christi Missal, SEP, authentic polyphony and organ music. NOTHING ELSE!

    We would not be out to duplicate CMAA or Watershed... I belong here like the rest of you for education, commradery, sharing musics, etc.

    THIS org are those who promote the music docs and want to LIVE THEM and are looking for like minded churches who want the same. Really, just a resource list of those who would be glad to have each other in their churches.

    Number 1... You would have to be an RC in good standing.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    So I'm out, in other words.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,482
    It's a support group?
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    Gavin:

    Why would you be out?
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    Adam:

    Yes... pretty much... perhaps more like a third order.
  • It WOULD be nice to have a network of like minded people, where, if a job opens up, you could say for sure "I could work with this priest. We'd still have to agree on money, benefits, and details, but I know that he wants GOOD MUSIC and NOT Haugen/Daas."

    Such is my frustration with the way the job threads here are handled. I WANT TO KNOW "This priest subscribes/doesn't subscribe to our ideals."
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    PGA

    Yes... it would remove all doubt.
  • I could suggest a RC in good standing in your own mind?

    With the current state of the church, NO people might not qualify as being in as good standing as some EF people might see them...and vice versa.
  • With the current state of the church, NO people might not qualify as being in as good standing as some EF people might see them...and vice versa.

    Thank you, FNJ.
    Your honor, the defense rests.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    Charles:

    You are the defense? What are you defending?

    qui non est mecum contra me est et qui non congregat mecum spargit

    FNJ said:

    With the current state of the church, NO people might not qualify as being in as good standing as some EF people might see them...and vice versa.


    Then we will have two levels of membership. Those who ONLY subscribe to the EF and those who will subscribe to both EF and NO. We will not except those who do not subscribe to the EF at all. That would go against everything we stand for which is to bring the EF to the world, and it's wonderful OFFICIAL (Universal) musics. We view the new musics of the Church (CCWS, SEP, etc., as stepping stones back to the foundation of Latin music, which is the universal prayer of the Church) Is that a clearer vision statement?

    "Come, Holy Spirit... fill the hearts of your faithful. Enkindle in us the fire of your love."

    Noel... since you only subscribe to the EF, your membership card will be exclusively in Latin and will be hand made with a quill. :)
  • This raises the question:

    Since the Vatican has the only ATM in the world that is in Latin, do they issue Latin Debit Cards?
  • I'm in favor of well-done NO and EF....I need to fix my profile.
  • You are the defense? What are you defending?

    Same thing as you, Francis, the Four Pillars! No worries, mate.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,847
    Since the Vatican has the only ATM in the world that is in Latin, do they issue Latin Debit Cards?


    Yes, but they are used as access cards to the confessional:

    'and forgive us our debits as we forgive our debtors'

    How to go to digital confession