Or just dots or episemas. I've noticed some really puzzling parts of the Credo. I mean, we know how it goes from the real thing but what about the average parish with no chant experience? I really do think that these editions could create lots of confusion and for no good reason.

It's sad to say, but I find people either "get" this type of singing or they don't. From the organ, I can lead a congregation full of people who have never set foot in our church in singing the Our Father with the same corporate rhythm they use for speaking. No problem. Then I have one professionally trained singer lead them, and we get a string of perfectly even eighth notes with an accent on every single one. I think you just need to have someone who "gets" this teach the rest of them. Priests, especially non-singing priests, are often very good at chanting.

I feel it is important to point out that the ICEL chants are not Gregorian compositions, but something entirely new which is based on or inspired by chant. Neither the rules of semiology nor the Solesmes rhythmic method apply. Trying to impose those rules on a composition which was not conceived with them in mind is dangerous.

Consider these two notes from the introduction to the ICEL music:

Black notes without stems are used in order not to imply equalist rhythms;

Notes in note groups are spaced close together rather than evenly spaced in order to make clear the syllables to which they are subordinate

Aristotle's explanation works for most and even nearly all. But every once in a while, I wonder how congregations are going to end up singing this - or choirs for that matter. My tendency would be to lengthen both notes in Ages. But the music gives no indication. Is it obvious from speech or am I importing some sense from the way I've sung the chant



Maybe it doesn't matter and eventually everyone will just settle into something workable.

apparently! I think it is morning.

Making recordings and promoting the music by hearing those who do sing it well is the best solution here.

I see nothing wrong with also promoting your own versions of the chants as well, if they are improvements, or especially neume notated versions. Eventually the best composition will become the favoured choice.

I've only tried singing a few of the ICEL chants, while they are sometimes inferior to the Anglican liturgical translations versions of the same melody, they appear to have been very good nevertheless.
I thought that Credo I and Credo III were excellent.

musicasacra.com/books/ordinary_of_the_mass_english1933.pdf <-there's the pinnacle of english chant for the ordinary of the mass. I've yet to find any ordinary out do that book. I've been typesetting the lux et origo and orbis factor settings in neumes and modern notation based on what's in it for future use in a local catholic anglican ordinariate mission.<br />
The more people here it sung beautifully acapella the more chance they have of falling in love with it and being deeply motivated to sing it themself.

Having EWTN or any other form of tv/internet/radio broadcast english language chant and antiphons would be very helpful.

I have had personal experience singing vernacular plainchant at western rite orthodox and traditional anglican churches. WHat aristolte said is true, the right leadership from someone who loves the music and has more experience with it is profoundly helpful. That is usually how it ends up becoming a tradition that is very successful.

Just remember if a bunch of protestants and or former protestant converts can happily sing the ordinary of the mass every week and find it enriches their faith, life long catholics can do the same.

Jeff, if you're talking about the ICEL website, Credo III is indeed still there. It's towards the bottom, after the explanations of the tones for the lessons.

Erik's got a very good point here.

It would be worthwhile for some of the chant experts we have to publish their own chant note editions of these to solve the problem. Erik's got a very good point here.

The English Hymnal printed chant in notation with three staves, top square notes, below modern with melody and accompaniment. That would be useful in this situation.

Erik P: in fairness to ICEL, they are merely following the method that has been used since 1904 in the official chant books.

By the way, you all probably know about the ICEL New Mass Translation Practice Videos, created by the CMAA (shared freely with the world).

CMAA video link on Chant Café — CMAA Vimeo channel

However, you may not realize that these chants are also available on CD.

The YouTubes and Vimeo videos done by the CMAA have gotten close to 50,000 views, so they are becoming a "standard."

NPM has a page that contains their recordings of these chants.

Erik P:

Everything the Editio Vaticana Committee produced: from the "common tones" to the Kyriale, Antiphonale, Graduale, and even the music for the reading of the Passion.

In terms of your view that rhythmic indications are very helpful to singers, Joseph Lennards would agree with you ...

oh it is amazing enough to have the music distributed for free download! this was a huge step.

Dear Claire, you can purchase the CD at this website.

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(By the way, Claire, great job in the Wilko Brouwers Video ! )