Simple English Propers
  • Royce Nickel
    Posts: 70
    A couple of days ago Jeffrey Tucker posted an article on Chant Cafe ("A Missal for the Choir") in which he aptly pointed out the need for music directors to have at hand a copy of the Missal or Sacramentary when planning music for liturgies.

    Working at a parish where the propers have never been sung before, I am planning to introduce to my choir the Communion antiphons for the Easter season from the Simple English Propers. As I have been studying the SEP antiphons, I have noticed that the texts of the antiphons differ from those given in the Sacramentary, and which are printed in the worship aids in use in the parish. I checked the archived Chant Cafe and Forum postings on the SEP, and while I found information on the methodology and rationale for the music -- the choice of modes, psalm tones, etc. -- I didn't find comparable information about the text source for the antiphons.

    I find the concept of the SEP brilliant, and believe it to be a wonderful gift for the Church. I would greatly appreciate hearing a response that would help me understand the relationship between the SEP and the Missal.
  • Andrew Motyka
    Posts: 944
    "I would greatly appreciate hearing a response that would help me understand the relationship between the SEP and the Missal."

    Simply put, there is little relationship. The antiphons in the Missal were put there for priests to RECITE when saying a Mass with no music. The proper sung antiphons of the Mass are found in the Graduale Romanum, and many of the Missal's antiphons differ from the ones in the Gradual. By the strict letter of the General Instruction on the Roman Missal, it is permitted to sing the texts found in the Missal, but historically speaking it is the Gradual chants that are actually sung.

    If I'm not mistaken, the Simple English Propers are taken from the Gradual translation, correct?
  • RagueneauRagueneau
    Posts: 2,592
    Royce, this article explains
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,160
    [deleted as it contained out-of-date info]
  • Charles in CenCA
    Posts: 2,416
    Glad you brought your question to the forum, Royce.
    Andrew, Jeff's and Richard, wait with joy for a reading of Royce's Mass at colloquium, is sublime!
    I'm so happy to have Royce to m' north and Chris A to my SEast joining us in Pitt. this June.
    Go Fresno, go Fresno, go Fresno.
  • Adam Bartlett
    Posts: 533
    Just for clarification here, the text sources of the SEP are as follows:

    Antiphons: English translations from the Gregorian Missal, which contains Graduale Romanum antiphons.
    Psalms: Revised Grail Psalter (originally we did a "Modified Douay", but then we switched to the RGP).
  • Royce Nickel
    Posts: 70
    Thank you to everyone who has so quickly and kindly responded to my query. Jeff, the article you linked in, from a back issue of Sacred Music on the differences between Missal antiphons and Gradual antiphons, was very helpful. In detail, it made the same point that Andrew expressed above in a nutshell: the antiphons printed in the modern Roman missal are meant to be recited, whereas the Gradual antiphons are for the choir. And that makes it very clear why the texts of the SEP antiphons differ in places from those of the Missal. Thank you, Adam, for responding, too. God bless you and those working with you as you shepherd the SEP project toward completion.
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    So this is what happens when demand outstrips available supply. We've shipped large quantities to Amazon three times now, and each time, they run out before the orders are filled.

    I think we can prepare for a second printing to take place in the next thirty days.
  • Gerry Brenes
    Posts: 6
    YES! I just recieved my copy of the SEP! Very excited.
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    You will be up all night singing antiphons and Psalms
  • Paul F. Ford
    Posts: 857
    I received a copy last night as a gift from a great young church musician, Joseph Balistreri of Detroit. I will be carrying it with me to all my talks here in Louisville. Glorious!
  • Paul F. Ford
    Posts: 857
    Mission half-accomplished: I featured the SEP at my Hovda lecture this afternoon and will mention it again tomorrow at my plenary address.
  • DougS
    Posts: 793
    Paul, my wife is looking forward to your address tomorrow. She'll be the smart, pretty one in the audience.
  • advocatusadvocatus
    Posts: 85
    Not only was SEP lauded by Dr. Ford, but JMO's Ralph Sherwin Mass and Corpus Christ Watershed also received a shout-out. And, of course, Psallite!
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    Dr. Ford! brilliant. Thank you for your integrity and enthusiasm.
  • RagueneauRagueneau
    Posts: 2,592
    removed
  • Paul F. Ford
    Posts: 857
    I hope someone captured a picture of me waving the SEP in front of 2000+ NPM-ers this morning.
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    Saying again: bless you Dr. Ford!!!

    Reviewing the history of the Simplex at the Cafe this morning, I gained new appreciation for your own efforts to bring the Simplex to life in our times and provide chanted propers for parishes.
  • benedictgal
    Posts: 798
    This morning, we made history in my little corner of South Texas. My dad's pastor is recovering from surgery and asked me to sing something brief as he entered the sanctuary from the sacristy. I downloaded the Introit for the 17th Sunday in Ordinary Time and the accompanying video tutorial. He was pleased, as was I.

    I don't read music, but, these were easy enough to follow, even though I was recording myself with the tutorial and rehearsing late last night and this morning. I did not have a chance to thoroughly learn the Communion antiphon, but, I made up my own melody along the way and it turned out okay. We will be using SEP next weekend.
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    The SEP was sung from coast to coast today!
  • benedictgal
    Posts: 798
    While we aren't exactly the Left, I mean, the West Coast, this was the first time, to my knowledge, that a parish in the deep South Texas border has tried this!
  • Charles in CenCA
    Posts: 2,416
    O, I can name that tune from the midwest portion of the Left Coast, with olives and a twist.
    Wendy and I toted our tablets to Mass this AM. At the ensemble Mass (contemporary) I normally chant the AG Introit and Communio. But we had SEP set on the tablets, and we chanted them thusly, even though we now have 10 copies of the book in hand. Making a point. Next time, we'll use the books, time after that maybe with a quiet guitar...
    The world is an oyster, the chant is a pearl of great price.
    Jeffrey, if you're nice to me, I may video record and post the "next time."
    BG, good on ye, gal.
    "As I went a-chanting, the naves of Laredo..."
  • noel jones, aagonoel jones, aago
    Posts: 6,605
    We would like a video with you singing from the tablets....there was an iPad in the loft at my wife's church this morning!
  • Charles in CenCA
    Posts: 2,416
    You just wanna see the fat guy. Got news for ya, I'm gonna photoshop any video of me to look like Charleston Heston with the stone decalogue as we're chanting.
    But it was sort of cool. And, as I tried expounding before at the Cafe and at PTB (Pray Tell Blog, Noel), this is likely going to be a serious and sanctioned mode of media delivery in da future.
  • benedictgal
    Posts: 798
    Dumb question, but, I'll ask anyway. Will there be a tutorial for the 18th Sunday in Ordinary Time?
  • BenBen
    Posts: 3,114
    We need to make a SEP app for iPod/iPad. Pull up scores and practice videos right from the app, maybe even integrate the iPad's limited ability to print.

    Any takers?
  • benedictgal
    Posts: 798
    Don't forget the Blackberry smartphone and the Playbook! Show blackberry people some love!!!
  • Jeffrey TuckerJeffrey Tucker
    Posts: 3,624
    18th is coming !
  • CHGiffenCHGiffen
    Posts: 5,151
    The future is already here: see this article at the CPDL Forums.
  • bkenney27bkenney27
    Posts: 444
    I realize I am resurrecting an old thread here, but I had the same question. I realize that the translations in the Roman Missal were intended for recitation and that those in the Gregorian Missal were intended for chanting; however, is there an official translation that we should be using? We would never differ from the translations set forth in the Missal for the ordinary, so why for the propers? Just an honest question because I am fairly new to the propers and planning music around them. As I am sure you know, introducing them to the Parish and selling a Parish that has previously relied on Haugen, Haas, and Schutte exclusively on the importance of the Propers is a difficult task. Any information on what the church expects of us and the official texts we should be using would be helpful. Thanks!
  • smvanroodesmvanroode
    Posts: 967
    However, is there an official translation that we should be using? We would never differ from the translations set forth in the Missal for the ordinary, so why for the propers?


    The Lumen Christi Missal uses an English translation of the Latin propers of the Graduale Romanum that both match the new translation of the Third Edition of the Roman Missal and has been approved for liturgical use. Moreover, many of these propers have been set to music (from p. 904 onwards).
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,451
    Your question is covered in dozens of threads and blog posts already.

    Short answers:
    -Missal and Graduale Propers are different in places. There is a lot of conjecture and backstory about why this is the case, but there is no official answer. They just are.
    -However, they are the same in a lot places.
    -There is an official translation of the Missal.
    -There is no official translation of the Graduale.
    -The GIRM refers to both the Graduale and the Missal in a way that is clear as to intent, but also fairly clear that the writers didn't really know what they were talking about.
    -English translations of the GR Propers are "covered" by AT LEAST options 4, "another liturgical chant."
    -The SEP used translations from The Gregorian Missal, a publication of Solesmes Abbey, which presents the chants of the Graduale along with vernacular translations and instructions. These are not official translations.
    -The Successor to the SEP, the Lumen Christi Missal, along with several other recent English-propers projects, use the official translations from the new Roman Missal wherever the Missal and Graduale propers are the same, and otherwise (I believe) use the translations of the Psalms from the Revised Grail Psalter.
  • bkenney27bkenney27
    Posts: 444
    I figured it must have been covered which is why I did a quick search and found this thread. I suppose I could have dug a bit deeper, but thank you for your response nonetheless.

    "Missal and Graduale Propers are different in places. There is a lot of conjecture and backstory about why this is the case, but there is no official answer. They just are."

    Good enough for me! I think this answers the majority of my questions.
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