CHANT NOTATION -
  • M. Jackson Osborn
    Posts: 8,369
    Of interest (and proof) some may want to take note that -
    At the Chapel of St Basil (Univ of St Thomas, Houston) for the last three weeks the congregation have been singing Fr Columba's English adaptation of the Orbis Factor mass. Without explanation we handed them leaflets on which was printed the mass in Gregorian notation. They just 'picked it up' with the choir and are singing it robustly. They have never sung this mass before. A very few, who don't like chant, have gone somewhere else for the summer. They have been more than made-up-for by standing room only visitors who have come to participate. The choir in question is the summer class (20 strong) of St Basil's School of Gregorian Chant. On our fifth and last Sunday we will sing the Novus Ordo in Latin using the same mass and full propers from the Graduale. People CAN, very easily, catch onto Gregorian notation. It is really self evident.
  • JamJam
    Posts: 636
    Most people I know can't read normal music anyway. So why would normal music be any different from Gregorian notation for someone like that? most people know up means higher pitch and down means a lower pitch, but they don't know solfege or key signatures... they just listen to the people who know the song and match pitch that way.

    And people who CAN read normal music ought to know even a little about solfege/intervals, and can learn the basic principle of Gregorian chant notation in fifteen minutes. I never understood what the big deal was about using it.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,937
    That's part of the problem. Neumes are not "normal" anymore. Kids who have music courses in or out of school don't use them. Neumes are like filmstrips. Most people below a certain age have never seen them, and likely never will. I think with a congregation you could use up and down arrows and it wouldn't make a great difference. They tend to sing what they hear more than the notation they read. I can read neumes for singing, but they drive me nuts to try and accompany. My aged brain resists meshing the the two notation systems together.
  • JamJam
    Posts: 636
    I would think that if you were using Gregorian chant notation, you wouldn't be accompanying it, because it would be chant.
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    Thank you Mr. Osborn for sharing the wonderful news. It is very encouraging.
    It's true if we don't show the chant notation, our next generation will never know them, and they will never know the secret of singing the beauty of chants.

    (If you really need to accompany chants and need to use modern notation, you should. But that doesn't mean the singers have to. The accaompaiment for chants is truly for the accompaniment, not leading or embellishing the singing. I don't think the accompanist need to play all the notes of the chant. The accompaniment should not be a crutch for chanters, but maybe just an addition for a different effect. Most beautiful chant accompaniment I heard are the ones done very quietly with simple chords all the way through. Requires lots of humilty and patience in organist part.)
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,937
    Well, Mia, you should perhaps rethink that. Sometimes I do accompany chant, other times I don't. It depends on time, place, circumstances, and whether or not my most talented singers are away. The best unaccompanied chant I have heard was sung from memory, not notation. Not a bad practice at all if you have the time to get the singers to memorize it. Humility has nothing to do with it. How you came up with that is beyond me.
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    Charles, I agree. It is good to memorize, but I don't see how you can sing chants and even memorize chants without knowing how to read neums. I cannot play and memorize Bach if they were written in neums, and the same goes with chants.
    My children's schola memorize many simple chants without knowing how to read neums. I'm trying to have them to develope their listening skills before they read notes. I believe you need both listening and reading skills to make music. This year I'll be introducing a few simple neums, and I am excited to see how many neums they can really learn to sing. They will learn at least how to sing podatus and mora vocis more beautifully. See them and hear them. The details of singing chants simply cannot be done from modern note-heads. Modern notation is not made for chant singing.
    As you said in the other thread, many Protestants sing hymns differently, because I think they either avoided or resisted Catholic tradition of chant and its style. If we use modern notation for Gregorian chants, mostly likey you will hear Protestant singing hymns instead of chants. Just sing every notes.(This was the hardest to correct in my schola. They are so used to singing hymns in Protestant style, and they try to sing chants like that.)
    I sing chants because they are sacred, universal and beautiful. I cannot sacrifice the beautiful part, even if it takes longer time and more work than just singing notes.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,937
    Mia, I agree that some music is too complex or lengthy to memorize easily. But simple chant melodies are pretty easy for good singers to memorize. They either have to read the neumes and memorize, or have a really good ear. Those are the singers who don't need accompaniment.
  • GavinGavin
    Posts: 2,799
    It also proves the roof doesn't cave in if you give the unwashed masses the propers to sing.
  • miacoyne
    Posts: 1,805
    One funny story. Last week our schola was trying to learn a Proper in 4 parts, and I have a schola member, who never sang in a choir and never learned to read notes, but is learning to read chant notation since she joined the schola. When she saw the 4 parts music in modern notation, she thought they were all PODATUS!. (She thought she had to sing alto note first then sop. note. She eventually figrued it out.) She and I had a real good laugh after the practice when she 'confessed.' She thinks it's really funny on her part that she knows chant notation, but doesn't know the modern notation. We will get to that.
    (I must add that she joined the schola with minimum knowledge of music, but she put her best effort in learning and singing everyday. She is one of my best chanter, and I'm very blessed to have her in my schola.)
  • ghmus7
    Posts: 1,469
    This is great news, Jackson! I am glad your summer schola is doing so well.
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