America the Beautiful at Mass
  • Hello all,

    As Independence Day is around the corner, I'm curious what people's thoughts are about singing America the Beautiful at Mass? I've heard this done as a recessional hymn, and have never been sure how I feel about it.
  • Liam
    Posts: 5,055
    It's done (less so on days *other* than Independence Day proper - a lot of parishes don't even have Mass on major summer holidays, and rarely would have music on weekday major summer holidays), though it wouldn't be my choice if it were up to me.

    The text is written as petitions in the subjunctive mood, but I suspect the percentage of people who understand that the text is in the subjunctive mood - rather than an oddly written indicative mood - is a small one.
  • trentonjconn
    Posts: 605
    Grammatical nuances aside, the hymn comes across as an ode to America (with perhaps honorable mention given to God). In my book, it's wholly inappropriate for Mass. Play God of Our Fathers if you're trying to do something patriotic which actually has depth.
  • Carol
    Posts: 856
    We will be singing it for the recessional as we have done for many years here. I don't mind it too much as long as we sing the verse with "God mend thine every flaw." I think praying for our country is a worthy endevour.
  • francis
    Posts: 10,759
    I suspect y’all know what my answer is…
    Thanked by 1Carol
  • ServiamScores
    Posts: 2,834
    As I’ve said in my “Music Minute” blurb in the worship aids before, vaguely religious sentiment (or even religious texts) are not enough to qualify as appropriate mass music. It might qualify the work as “Christian” or “devotional” music, but that doesn’t make it mass music. I think Trenton nails it:
    comes across as an ode to America (with perhaps honorable mention given to God)

    Having just reread the text, there’s no doubt it’s an ode to America. It is not a hymn to God. It is an ode, that happens to ask for God’s blessing.

    I also wary of muddying the waters between secular and religious calendars. The 13th Sunday in OT has no recourse to a “regional” observance in the USA that doesn’t even coincide with the day we will actually be at mass (unless of course you’re having a special Independence Day mass.)
  • francis
    Posts: 10,759
    Thank you Serviam… you said it better than I could’ve said it
  • Jeffrey Quick
    Posts: 2,083
    No.
    It's a hymn of praise to a country. The prayer element is a fig leaf.
    My Ordo says it's the Fifth Sunday after Pentecost, not Caesar Sunday.
    Why is this so hard for people to get right?
  • MarkB
    Posts: 1,060
    I've programmed it for the recessional this Sunday. The Sunday closest to July 4 is the only occasion on which I will program that hymn, it's the only patriotic song I use during the year, and I will only program it as the recessional hymn because Mass has concluded so it's technically not within the Mass even though it is Mass-adjacent.

    The Church teaches that patriotism is a virtue, and the song does pray for God's blessings upon the United States, even if that's not the dominant lyrical emphasis. I think singing it as a recessional song is justifiable around Independence Day, although I also think a respectable case can be made for not singing it.

    Some parishioners here pray the "patriotic rosary" in the church on the Sunday nearest to Veterans' Day every year. Pastor has no involvement in that. I also decline to participate in it. I've shared my misgivings about it with the pastor, but he allows it. Big military city.
    Thanked by 1Carol
  • ServiamScores
    Posts: 2,834
    Patriotism is a virtue, yes. But that doesn’t give give us a green light to sing what are essentially secular anthems at Mass. Encouraging patriotism during a homily, or even preluding/postluding i those themes might be a more appropriate expression of patriotism, but I digress.
    because Mass has concluded so it's technically not within the Mass even though it is Mass-adjacent.
    this argument has always seemed a straw man to me, if I’m being honest. It’s a gotcha!* way of bending rules. Spirit of the law vs. letter of the law and all that.
    Thanked by 1LauraKaz
  • I've programmed(?) as recessional "Mine Eyes Have Seen the Glory." We'll see how that goes.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 9,196
    For people who haven't decided yet, I'd avoid that song, "The Battle Hymn of the Republic". It's a thumping march, and who wants that after hearing beautiful music at Mass? It's got an apocalyptic text full of images of warfare, and it reminds listeners of the horrible US Civil War. Independence Day on July 4 is not about that.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,965
    My pastor wanted "God of our Fathers" and "America the Beautiful" for the Sunday nearest July 4th. I didn't think it worth it to die on that hill so we sang them. The following week more than half the congregation couldn't remember what we sang the week before, anyway.
  • AnimaVocis
    Posts: 136
    Hmm.... I recall the [Missal] propers today saying something along the lines of "All peoples, clap your hands..." and "Bless the Lord, O my Soul..." not sure how patriotic hymns fit into those...

    Humbly (in my opinion), first consideration for hymns at Mass should be given to those that reflect the spirit of the propers, and/or those that directly tie into the lectionary (use those interchangeably as you might for the first orders of preference...)

    Then consideration should be give to the LITURGICAL time of year (if possible). Other considerations come last.

    Personally, I've never found that I have ever gone beyond lectionary and propers in deciding on hymns.

    I think people desire to sing "America the Beautiful", or "God Bless America", or whatever else not out of patriotism, but out of sentimentality (.... I seem to recall another thread on this topic...).

    While I'm all for being pastoral in approach to hymns and knowing that we have to teach people about what kind of music to expect and desire at the Mass (that of wholly Sacred and Beautiful texts [in an objective sense]), we begin by not catering to every facet of sentimentality under the guise of patriotism, or pretending to pray for one's country by using texts that are not at home in the Mass. (I.e. the Mass DOES NOT form itself to us.... we form ourselves to the Mass.)

    Regardless, happy Fourth of July, all! Thanks be to God above for the freedoms we enjoy here, and we continue to pray for all our heads of state, our soldiers, and all who make this country worth living in (even though it can be annoying at times... ;) )
  • Don9of11Don9of11
    Posts: 699
    There are alternatives to "America the Beautiful" such as "God Bless America," although you probably won't find "God Bless America" in any missallete.

    There is also Cardinal O'Connell's "The Cross and the Flag," and "Faith and Fatherland." You can find these in "The Holy Cross Hymnal" on the Corpus Christi website https://www.ccwatershed.org/2018/10/30/brebeuf-hymnal-source-material/

    There is also Joyce Kilmer's "Prayer of a Soldier," this is a nice hymn in which Kilmer compares the journey of a soldier to Christ's compassion on the Cross. You can find that in the Pius X hymnal.
  • CatholicZ09
    Posts: 282
    Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception in D.C. used this yesterday. I had never heard of it. I think it’s a great alternative to “America the Beautiful.” Author is Henry Scott Holland & is in the Public Domain..


    Tune: LAUDA ANIMA

    Judge Eternal, throned in splendor,
    Lord of lords and King of kings,
    with your living fire of judgment
    purge this land of bitter things;
    solace all its wide dominion
    with the healing of your wings.

    Still the weary folk are pining
    for the hour that brings release,
    and the city’s crowded clangor
    cries aloud for sin to cease,
    and the homesteads and the woodlands
    plead in silence for their peace.

    Crown, O God, your own endeavor;
    cleave our darkness with your sword;
    feed the faithless and the hungry
    with the richness of your word;
    cleanse the body of this nation
    through the glory of the Lord.
  • AnimaVocis
    Posts: 136
    @CatholicZ09

    I really like that! Thank you for sharing!
  • GambaGamba
    Posts: 546
    Gerre Hancock wrote a cracking anthem on the “Judge eternal” text. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5sNKy0SRzAs
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • ServiamScores
    Posts: 2,834
    3:15 in that recording is EPIC.