I am music director for an FSSP parish, and we have a sung liturgy every week except for two months during summer.
Honestly, I love taking my own ego out of it and being required to sing the propers. At this point, we still use Rossini for two of the five, and hope to be full propers almost exclusively in two years.

Besides being wonderful prayers, singing the propers gives me a chance to accept the liturgy as something given, something I work toward, and not something I craft. That approach is worlds away from how I operated in OF parishes, what with liturgy committees asking for their favorite songs and pastors making requests. How many Saturday nights did I sit around and choose four hymns, mostly taking into consideration 1) what the pastor wanted, 2) what sort of connected to the readings and would not rock the boat, and 3) what I could personally tolerate.

This is not to say that the OF can't be celebrated beautifully and according to the ideal, of course. Colloquium liturgies are an exemplar.

Even so, I wonder if the biggest problem with the myriad of options in the OF is that human nature sets in and we often end up with the easiest or most favorite. How often does 'the people should be able to sing it' mask another motive: 'whatever is familiar or easiest'.

Perhaps "ego" is not always the problem. People don't submit for a lot of reasons, some of them having to do with ignorance and custom. Some probably having to do with devotion!

Fortunately the propers are inherently attractive. The more they're used, the more people will want to sing them.

I think the lack of availability of English propers for some years after the switch to the vernacular, caused propers to disappear. Most took it as a mandate to change everything into English, so with no sources, there was no usage. When the English propers became available, hardly anyone cared anymore and saw no reason to change. Of course, by this time, many did not even know what propers were. Given that so many parish music programs were taken over by "nun-strummers" with little musical education, ignorance was a also a factor.

What to do now? I have re-introduced communion propers, and it's been a success. Perhaps my next move in another year, will be to put the offertory propers back in. As for the introits, I have used them for special events, for example, the bishop processing in at confirmation before beginning the entrance hymn. Even then, I used a 4-part Russian chant, not Gregorian. I have no plans to restore the introits at Sunday masses, because I think stately, powerful entrance hymns simply work better for processions. Not everything in the EF transfers well into the OF, and I find the introit is an example of that. I fully expect to be damned to the eternal flames by the next few posters for not loving introits, but that's the way it is. I find them too musically "weak" for processions. They may have been fine for the priest coming a few feet from the sacristy, but don't seem to work as well for long processions. However, introits are still useful as preludes and the text, if in a language understood by the congregation, can set the tone for what follows.

I'm going to respond with a rather literal "take" on the notion of "place." This coincides with having just yesterday done "my duty" by completely filling out OCP's "Music Issue Survey," which I regard as pointless (not meaningless) and obligatory. It will get sent along with my usual apparently irritating suggestions.
Ahem,
Those of us "here at CMAA" and many others obviously have crossed a perceptual threshold regarding the myriad issues of how liturgy is best conducted, performed and prayed. And we see some form of beatific vision that we believe we can enact both locally and universally. Around here, we seem to have agreed that such vision requires us to freely "care enough to FREELY SHARE our very best" with our musical gifts and talents. The issues that Jeffrey has so eloquently and repeatedly emphasized regarding IP and creative commons v. copyright restrictions is at the crux of the dilemma of the "proper place."
Discussions over the years with my pastors and vicars about these issues result, at best, with some sort of resignation to keep the status quo of the major publishers' newsprint worship aides. Why? IMO, simply because of our penchant and addiction for the convenient fix. Priests and musicians agree that this or that solution might be more "ideal," but the TPTB hold sway that (for example, currently) the Missal and Psalter texts will soon change, the English translations and chanted settings await promulgation, logistically in this economy we have neither the strategic nor personnel resources to abandon the leaflet missals for weekly handouts, much less the stomach required that would demand more coherency of music selection on the part of disparate musical leaders, etc., yada, and so forth.
Now before countering with the absolutely perfect suggestion that the answer lies in the easy switch to a PBC or the Gregorian Missal, we have to look back to the other side of the threshold and see that modern American worship reflects modern American values that have held sway despite the parodies of "How to Succeed in Business Without Really Trying" and "Madmen."
To me, interestingly the Liturgical Press Company offers two contrasting examples of how a fairly large business enterprise has tried to solve this problem of "proper place" with distinctively different approaches. BY FLOWING WATERS is generally acknowledged as one of noblest attempts to organically reintroduce many of the ideals of the "Mahrt" paradigm into parish worship, and was so salutated. And a couple of years ago the same company introduced PSALLITE, which as far as I'm aware didn't even make it up an eighth of the length of the proverbial flagpole. They (with no disrespect to Dr. Ford or the other editors) along with the Adoremus Society's first hymnal edition, the Collegeville Hymnal, and others basically operate in the "niche market" level of the worship aide economy.
So, where will the "proper place for propers" actually end up being? Hopefully, through some sort of near-miraculous collaboration of the USCCB/BCL, NPM, CMAA, other stakeholders with the "Industrial Liturgical Complex" of so villified recent memory. Gasp, "Do you suggest that BREAKING BREAD actually could continue to prosper with the inclusion of select settings of the Propers printed in their correct locations (ala Gregorian Missal) or as a sequential section, alongside the requisite hymns, songs, psalm settings and Ordinaries? Well, do you, Charles?" Ready now for the Bride to cold-cock me, I do. What's more, remembering that most of us do not work anywhere's remotely near the existential territory of St. John Cantius, I believe that because of our inherent preferential option for the convenient, the conventional wisdom still resides in Portland and Chicago; and that was why the USCCB walked away from the Pandora's Box a few November plenaries ago and deferred the "white list" of texts to those Sees. (Incidentally, having Francis Cardinal George preside at colloquium gave me much more hope in this regard. I can live with that.)
Whether or not, once the texts of the Missal and Psalter are released, each parish invests in a hardbound or newsprint missal/hymnal, TPTB that have more muscle and influence over tptb will have convinced those publishers to advance the works of the Ford's, Weber's, Kelly's, Ostrowski's, Rice's et al for inclusion within their main product offerings.
Then progress will be made real in the hands and sight of the celebrants and the faithful.
I know this vision falls short of the real paradigm, an optimally fuller return to the tradition of the chant and augmentation of same through the beauty of polyphony.
But I can't see any other macro-systematic way to further this process along.

Charles, I have successfully resisted buying anything from OCP for many years now. Every time that idea comes up, I squelch it. However, that doesn't mean I am all that happy with what we get from WLP, which is a small number of missalettes for daily mass and for the choir. We only buy enough for the Sunday congregation during Lent, because of stations, benedictions, etc. which are in the missalettes. We use the RitualSong hymnal, for no other reason than we own enough copies for everyone. For the propers, I have to make photocopies for the choir. It would be great if they were in the hymnal, but they are not.

CW, I'm glad that, at least, RITUALSONG is your default hymnal, it is, IMO, the most comprehensive of the big gun offerings. We also use xeroxed propers for the schola and choir.
The point of my post, though, was that they, as well as their Latin counterparts and other items, OUGHT TO BE MANDATED to be included in all hymnals and worship aides by TPTB.

I know many people bristle at this suggestion, but we really do have to move slowly. I have bought into this notion.

For my part, I have resigned myself to the probable fact that my work in restoring sacred liturgy will only go so far in my lifetime. I'm 26 years old. I fully expect to die at a ripe old age and STILL have "Here I am, Lord" and "Eagle's Wings" in the hymnals that are in the pews. BUT - might it be commonplace by that time for the choir of nearly every church to be singing latin motets regulary? Might it also be a matter of fact that every church has an organ, and it is used regularly and is the primary instrument for most of the masses? And will the people in the pews be singing certain parts of the ordinary in latin on a very regular basis in nearly every parish in the country?

If we will have moved that far by the time I die, I will be happy. I already see progress from the time I began doing this work up till now.

This mess took a long time to get into, and it's going to take a long time to get out of. It will probably be more than 100 years before we are back to chanted propers at every mass and true sacred music as being a universal tenet of the Roman Catholic Church.

Who got it right, where and when? That is, have we, since the chant revival of the 19th century, been looking back to a mythical golden age, in which ordinary and propers were chanted thoughout Christendom? Or might discussions like this have been taking place for centuries (granted that the Novus Ordo will have brought a new dimension to them)?

Noel, this is likely redundant to what you've already realized- the Holy Roman Catholic Church is not a denomination. Your point, though, is as sadly true as it is ironic and moronic.
BTW, your dedication repertoire is magnificent.

Aristotle, I was out the office door and almost at my car....but some ladies were waiting in the hot valley sun for a volunteer at the building where I'm located (former convent.) So, I've let them in and have made the time.

You might recall seeing during one of the midweek Masses an elderly man wearing a blue/white ethnic looking hat towards the front third of the nave on the gospel side. He was wearing shorts and flip flops with socks. He never took off his little hat until he approached the altar for reception. He clearly wasn't colloquium, but he was obviously knowledgeable if not pious, save for the little hat. Didn't think anything about it.
I then was asked by Dr. Treacy if I could drive her to Walgreen's for a second visit as she'd broken her only pair of glasses and had purchased some reading lenses at a magnification that was too powerful. So, said "sure" and off we went. As in the previous day's trek, it was hurried as she had a board meeting on this particular day during lunch. She was exchanging glasses at the front clerk's as I noticed THE OLD MAN standing at the entrance. I went up to him and asked "Sir, did you enjoy this morning's Mass?" He looked, smiled a little forlornly, and said in a vague European accent, "Yes, I very much did...Dominus vobiscum." "Et cum Spritu tuo." I replied. Then he said "I don't think those days will be ever coming back." I looked at Dr. Treacy and back at him and said, "Oh, sir, don't believe that. That is why we are here, now in this city. There are many of us working very hard to help restore beauty and solemn worship and music to the Church." He smiled, shook our hands, we thanked each other and Dr. Treacy and I returned to the campus. Maybe he was CMAA's angel that day, found hospitality in our tent, and we can expect a renaissance in a year or so! God willing.

Beautiful; thanks, Charles :)

likewise beautiful, Kathy; thanks. Seems we're all on "God's side" here. That seems proper.

Thank you Charles. I had noticed that gentleman as well and wondered how he found us- or more to the point- what he thought of us. There are no coincidences.

Where, in the US, can one find a place where the songbook in the pews is The Gregorian Missal?

One of the two keynote speakers for this year's event is retired bishop, Abp. Remi DeRoo of Vancouver, a self-proclaimed evangelist for the Spirit of Vatican II. As a curiosity, I'd invite anyone to google the archbishop's name, read a link to an interview (2002) in (then-named) Modern Liturgy and take in his contentions about what exactly were the pre-eminent concerns of the council and how they've not been realized in liturgy.

Not to mention, IIRC, his Excellency's presidency over one of the funnier Giant Puppet Liturgies in recent memory.
(Photos of it inspired me, and I came up with a solution to the "vocation shortage.")
(Save the Liturgy, Save the World)

LOL!!

G, you're the Weird Al of the liturgical world. Well done!

We're asking them to adopt, as their own, a monastic culture, a monastic spirituality.

This is what the Eastern Church does.

That was not the norm at either of the two parishes where I sang (Diocese of Cleveland) in the late 50s/early 60s. Daily Masses (6:30, 8, noon) were Low Masses. Sunday 10:45 was the only sung Mass.

Same applied when we visited family in New York and Boston,

St. Edward Newark CA has Gregorian Missal in the pews! (found via google search..i've not been there)

Where, in the US, can one find a place where the songbook in the pews is The Gregorian Missal?

At the brunch on Sunday at the close of the Colloquium, I suggested to Jeffrey that it would be interesting to know what kind of services the Colloquium folks are involved in at their parish: OF or EF or both? Latin, English? High mass/low mass in EF? Gregorian propers, mixed Latin/English, Rossini, or just hymns, what for propers? What hymnal in the pews/songsheets printed up to provide music for mass, etc. Clearly, there would be many more possible questions, so many that the whole thing might become too cumbersome to be of much use. St. John Cantius, for example, seems to offer every possible option in both forms, except the missa groovy.
Such information would only speak for this group, and not the vast majority of Catholic parishes, but I still think I might find encouragement seeing where my situation fits on the continuum of this historical movement we find ourselves in--endeavoring to alter the course of Catholic ecclesial culture in the USA. Fortunately, we have Pope Benedict at the helm and we just can't go too wrong if we know how to be patient, and ultimately refer all our efforts to his steady guidance which is readily available in so many writings.
It occurs to me that possibly the one thing that distinguishes the CMAA group from mainstream (?) Catholic musicians is a higher level of musical training, not to mention liturgical education that we've mostly, I suspect, pursued largely on our own. So it comes back to education with a big E, hardly an original observation of mine.
And if I may reiterate more or less, I find it very instructive to be working with the local EF community. That culture in many ways reveals where we were before Vatican II. The challenges I face in attempting to bring the local customary liturgy more in line with the EF ideals (high mass as a rule on Sunday, Gregorian propers, congregational parciticpation in the ordinary--when we're allowed to, once a month at the high mass) are curiously similar to the challenges most of the rest of you deal with in the context of the OF. I'm curious how many speakers in this forum work with the EF, and how it is working in their parish. We know St. John Cantius and Mater Ecclesia are exceptional.

The Gregorian Missal is rather too expensive to have in the pews, isn't it?

Tom: St. Joseph's Church in Detroit has the Gregorian Missal and Adoremus Hymnal in the pews for their Ordinary Form Masses.

Mon cher MA, at least it means they're provided the opportunity with the occasion to do so.
Well done, Detroit.

Charles, I see your point. I think its dreamy, but I'm not opposed to beautiful dreamers like yourself.
With the GM in the pews the people could at least follow along, and benefit from the translations. Its a greener long term solution (in the OF) than disposable hymnals without proper texts. And it saves musicians from making worship aids.

But I agree with marymezzo's practical advice on catechesis regarding who sings what and why. Most of the faithful would love to know some clear expectations. And I've witnessed the same resounding responses at several parishes.

marymezzo: "It really doesn't make sense for the Gregorian Missal to be in the pews when there is no expectation that the congregation ought to sing the propers."

The Gregorian Missal is much more than just the propers (neums and Latin).

The Order of Mass: side-by-side Latin and English, dialogues chanted, etc.
Mass Ordinaries: all seventeen, plus six Credo, plus others.
All Sundays, Solemnities, Feasts:
translations for the propers, side-by-side Latin and English texts, scripture citations everywhere.

Think of the Gregorian Missal as a Rosetta Stone,
an artifact which will be instrumental in
advancing the understanding of both Liturgy and Latin.