IntoAccount’s full report on David Haas
  • GambaGamba
    Posts: 350
    This report was released this week. “Disgusting” and “sordid” don’t begin to describe his behavior.

    https://intoaccount.org/davidhaas/

  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    Guess who will be getting "dust and ashes" in his Christmas stocking this year?
    Thanked by 2tomjaw Carol
  • Carol
    Posts: 695
    This is so sad! It makes me so upset that this is the first thing some people think of when someone mentions the Catholic church.
  • MarkB
    Posts: 682
    GIA was complicit for a long time. The company looked the other way because he was their #1 hitmaker.

    The report surpasses what I imagined the worst could be.

    David Haas systematically and deliberately used his music and church ministry and celebrity stature to provide grooming, seduction, manipulation and sudden attack opportunities for four decades. His teen music ministry camp was apparently a vehicle to provide him with a steady stream of adoring, trusting, impressionable, vulnerable young women away from the safety of friends and family.

    That this went on for so long... executives at GIA and authorities in his diocese have some deep soul searching to do. And some heads should roll besides David's.
  • Why is there no mention of criminal proceedings?
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • Why is there no mention of criminal proceedings?


    I would guess two reasons:

    * Outside the scope of the report
    * Statutes of limitations probably apply in many if not most cases
  • MarkB
    Posts: 682
    Re: no mention of criminal proceedings, the first few pages of the report provide history and speculative explanation. I won't repeat the specific offense here, but the first reported offense in 1979 was certainly something criminally prosecutable and should have resulted in felony criminal charges. Because the offense occurred at a church function, a counselor reported it to archdiocesan clergy, even to the bishop, all of whom intimidatingly said that the 13 year-old girl was responsible and she should be ashamed. The dismissive clergy were all later revealed to have been deeply involved in covering up clergy sexual abuse of minors in the archdiocese. Why the counselor who assisted the girl didn't go to the police? I don't know. It's unclear whether the victim's parents knew.

    The speculative part that follows is that David might have been coached by those same clergy about how to be more selective and discreet and to play the long bonding game in order to reduce the likelihood that a victim would report an assault or that an assault would be prosecutable. Evidence also appears to reveal that David would groom minors in their teens, becoming markedly more aggressive after their 18th birthdays as a tactic to avoid prosecution because the victims were of legal age and the offenses not as clear-cut nor felonious as the first 1979 offense. Lack of witnesses in many cases also reduced the likelihood of being prosecuted even if an assault had been reported to law enforcement.
    Thanked by 2CharlesW Caleferink
  • davido
    Posts: 516
    It’s so sad

    “For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.“
    Thanked by 2ServiamScores Carol
  • My choir had a bonfire made of all of David Haas’s music. And they did so without my prompting. Made me proud.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    In reality, Haas should be a wealthy man by now and not need to ever work again.
    Thanked by 1kenstb
  • MarkB
    Posts: 682
    I think that's why he's gone away quietly, and I bet he also got a nice settlement check from GIA to go away quietly and to allow his music to be buried. The ride's over, but he doesn't need it anymore.
    Thanked by 1CharlesW
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    Wish I could be sure that in the future when the furor dies down, someone wont bring his music back.
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen tomjaw
  • Chrism
    Posts: 809
    I was confused by his contradictory behaviors, but he explained it by saying that God allowed us to love more than one person intimately, and that his ability to feel love toward more than one woman was part of that.

    ... On the way there, he apologized, but again said that God did not intend us to be monogamous...

    Over the years, David talked to me about some of his beliefs and thoughts about love and relationships. The ideas he talked about the most were:
    1) that God did not create us to love only one person, and that we were called to express that love in physical, as well as spiritual, ways...



    On the positive side, the theologically vapid works of someone who theologically opposes the moral dogma of Christian monogamy have been stricken from the Catholic repertoire.

    Now let us wait, however, for the other shoe to drop: the cancellation of some great hymn writers from the past on spurious grounds like having held now-outmoded political opinions back when viable alternatives were worse.
  • Chrism, I could see that happening in, say, PCUSA or the Southern Baptists. But the wing of the "one" HC&A Church that is likely to do that doesn't really use those hymns anyway, and the wing that does use them doesn't do cancel culture.
    Thanked by 1Caleferink
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    I tend to agree with Bishop Stika that one is innocent until proven guilty. When I turn on the TV it seems I am bombarded with hysteria after hysteria on things that have not been properly investigated or substantiated. So bring forth the charges and either prove them or drop them. However, I must admit the evidence is stacking up and it doesn't sound good at all. I just retired from church music but I can assure you I never used this composer's music. I thought it was trash and stand by that.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • a_f_hawkins
    Posts: 2,728
    Haas has said "I have come to realize that I have caused great harm to a variety of people. I make no excuses for any harm that I may have caused. I take responsibility for my behavior and I am truly sorry." That is not an admission of any particular incident, but it is an admission of serious sin. It was published, by Haas, on July 9. As Bishop Stika wrote "a person has a presumed innocence until the person either admits guilt or ...". Is accepting responsibilty the same as admitting guilt, not perhaps in US law.
    Thanked by 1ServiamScores
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    Bishop Stika is a fair-minded person who wants to gather facts before making off-the-cuff judgements. Nothing at all wrong with that. Don't get into U.S. law. You'll be there all week and still prove nothing. Everything is subject to appeal.

    SNAP, on the other hand, is the proverbial bunch of old ladies in tennis shoes. They leap to every judgement, protest when the sun comes up, will do anything to get press coverage, and are not the most rational of people to begin with.

    I think there are other reasons to not use music composed by Haas. It is not worthy of liturgy, is badly written, and can be thrown out for many reasons of taste, suitability, and artistic worth - or lack of it. Perhaps this scandal just adds to the many valid reasons for not purchasing or using his compositions.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • ncicero
    Posts: 36
    Everything in this report about Haas's behavior is truly disgusting, but I'm surprised nobody has mentioned two parts that really stuck out to me about his music!

    Page 16: "Many survivors reported to us that, “David played by his own set of rules.” For the most
    part, it seems, every institution that might have constrained or disciplined his abusive
    behaviors, whether in the church, the Catholic educational system, or the liturgical
    publishing industry, allowed “David’s rules” to override other considerations: financial
    norms, musical quality, and of course, the physical and spiritual safety of women and
    children."

    BINGO. It's unclear if the demand for his music existed before GIA promoted it heavily, but it is clear that at any rate, they made him what he was, and I believe help cement his (unearned IMO) "celebrity status" within the community, and inflate his own ego.

    Page 19, quoting an unnamed "composer colleague":
    “For the last 25 years or so, DH put out an *obscene* amount of music and other publications, more than any other composer I know by a very long shot. It was pretty universally accepted that the music was of terrible quality (almost all the songs people mourn were written early on, most people couldn’t name any of the recent ones). He would even re-record old songs for no apparent reason multiple times. I always wondered why he put so much stuff out (it doesn’t make financial sense) and why he didn’t care about the quality. I’m realizing that his whole life was structured around this pattern of abuse. At recording sessions and conferences he would abuse. But when he was home, he would manically create projects because they gave him access to the studio and to conferences to promote it. It was an obsession. This is also why he would get so upset when Kate [Kate Williams, Senior Managing Editor at GIA Publications] would try to slow him down. Ego, sure. But I think it was more akin to a serial predator who saw his access to victims being taken away.”

    Sobering, sad, and disgusting to say the least. I hope the Catholic music publishing industry learns a big lesson from this. I will withhold any further comment.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    I hope the Catholic music publishing industry learns a big lesson from this. I will withhold any further comment.


    They never learn. They serve another God, $$$$$$
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • francisfrancis
    Posts: 9,575
    Charles... it is spelled, god, with a small G.
    Thanked by 1tomjaw
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    Oh No. I am afraid $$$$$$ has eclipsed YHWH in our culture. Ask most pastors which is more important.
  • Like I said long ago before being “silenced” for reporting the truth,
    It was only matter of time. And I will continue to say what it needs to be said so no one will be subjected to these predators in the future.

    I will continue to say that many knew and many more will need to respond for this so we can clean up all of the our so-called music libraries and toss so many “modern” hymnals.
    This individual wrote music and played with many composers, singers that knew. No one can deny that.
    And hopefully one day we’ll really play and listen to the music that is sacred by nature that moves our souls rather than our bellies and the wallets.
    I wonder who can “cancel” now all of those that have spoken the truth for years but only found rejection l, walls in front of them and people too scared to stand for the truth.
    Thanked by 2MarkB CharlesW
  • GambaGamba
    Posts: 350
    https://youtu.be/wgLpXrs2FNI

    New video from 16 of Haas’s 50+ victims who contacted IntoAccount.
  • Heath
    Posts: 882
    I've been a part of this forum since it's inception and I know it's always been a place of "no thought unexpressed." But some of the comments above have crossed the line. I had a rebuke composed in my head, but there was no way I could I write it while staying charitable, so I'll just share this firsthand account from a victim and hope it brings some perspective for those in short supply:

    http://www.ourstoriesuntold.com/i-am-mine-undoing-the-19-year-hold-that-david-haas-had-on-my-life-part-1-of-3/

    UPDATE: A couple of the more inane comments that I was referring to were taken down. Thank you, Richard.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    See what can happen to you when you stray from Gregorian chant.

    I think I was raised to be strong and to be naturally suspicious of others. I have difficulty believing anyone could be as naïve as your "victim." Adults do not seek or want the company of youngsters outside of their families and those with any sense at all never seek to be alone with minors. When I taught school our faculty taught the kids to be alert for those grooming behaviors. And again, we were never alone with minors for any reason. Sounds like this young lady could have benefited from a suspicious helicopter parent. Makes me wonder where the actual adults were at those conferences.

    If anyone sang "You Are Mine" to me, I would hit them with a chair.
  • Kathy
    Posts: 5,364
    Maybe purple bold is less helpful in some threads than others.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 8,712
    I'm taking out a few comments.
  • Kathy
    Posts: 5,364
    I'd suggest that the following dynamics are just a few of the things worth thinking and talking about while reflecting on this cautionary tale.

    -Older people interacting with younger people in the Church.
    -Spiritual leaders and their relationships with those who look up to them.
    -Discipling vs. Grooming, and how to tell the difference from the outside. And then, what to do about grooming.
    -Systematic preferences for church celebrities and moneymakers.
    -The characterization of multiple abusers as dynamic, charismatic, vibrant, etc.
    -The size and/or strength differences between most men and everyone else, that is women and the young.

    Many good church musicians want to pass along the craft to younger people. So what are the concrete, measurable practices and safeguards that make this possible without any danger to the young, or for that matter unfounded suspicions being aimed at the old?
  • francisfrancis
    Posts: 9,575
    “Be holy as I am Holy” is the first place to start.

    As children of obedience, not fashioned according to the former desires of your ignorance,

    But according to him that hath called you, who is holy, be you also in all manner of conversation holy:

    Because it is written: You shall be holy, for I am holy.

    And if you invoke as Father him who, without respect of persons, judgeth according to every one's work: converse in fear during the time of your sojourning here.

    Knowing that you were not redeemed with corruptible things, as gold or silver, from your vain conversation of the tradition of your fathers:

    But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb unspotted and undefiled

    Foreknown indeed before the foundation of the world, but manifested in the last times for you:

    Who through him are faithful in God who raised him up from the dead and hath given him glory, that your faith and hope might be in God.

    Purifying your souls in the obedience of charity, with a brotherly love, from a sincere heart love one another earnestly:

    Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but incorruptible, by the word of God who liveth and remaineth for ever.
    Thanked by 2sdtalley3 CharlesW
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    This diocese is good at insisting on chaperones for any kind of conference involving children or vulnerable adults. Those chaperones have also gone through training on protecting those vulnerable folks. When I actually gave lessons before retiring, I asked that a parent or guardian be present during those lessons. Even when teaching school I made sure that others were around when coaching reading after school. The library door was always open during those times. I wouldn't want to create a climate where everyone is under suspicion but one can't be too careful these days. I have to think that in the original posts, that composer who shall not be named, depended on many people looking the other way and not getting involved.
  • francisfrancis
    Posts: 9,575
    No amount of 'training' to be a Christian will be enough... one must love Jesus and Mary with their entire heart, mind body and soul... live in chastity and charity... that is the only way for a loving and protective environment to be assured.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    That environment you mentioned is called Heaven. It doesn't exist on earth.
  • francisfrancis
    Posts: 9,575
    nonsense... i know the place and the people who live 'heaven on earth'... those who live totally for the Kingdom of God... right here, right now... there are very few places (and people), i will grant you that, but they do exist...

    a man goes out into a field... when he finds buried treasure, he sells all he owns to obtain it... the almost impossible task is finding it.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    there are very few places (and people), i will grant you that,


    Yep. Very few.
    Thanked by 1francis
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 8,712
    When writing on this topic, please keep in mind that -- especially because church musicians are involved -- people who suffered in this case (or similar cases) may end up reading what you write.
  • PolskaPiano
    Posts: 217
    I am interested in GIA's stance on Lori True after reading this report. . .
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    GIA's stance is what's best for the bottom line. They are no different than the other publishers.
    Thanked by 1MarkB
  • See what can happen to you when you stray from Gregorian chant.


    One word for you. Silverstream.
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    Since I don't know what silverstream is, I don't know what you mean. Even Google, which knows all, tells all, is a bit fuzzy on what it is.
  • Pax is referring to Silverstream Priory.
    Thanked by 1CharlesW
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 11,278
    Thanks, Tim. I hadn't heard of this one.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 8,712
    At my parish on Sunday, the priest's homily mentioned the sins of the tongue, such as gossip and detraction; and I'm aware of when I've failed in this area. Please let's not extend this thread into other cases of personal failings among the clergy. That's not what we're here for.
This discussion has been closed.
All Discussions