Choral Regina Caeli - New Work
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    (Bumping now that it isn't the busiest time of the year.)

    Any thoughts on this?
    Anyone planning to use it next year?
  • Adam,

    Thank you for composing it. It has brightened my day.

    Thanked by 1Adam Wood
  • Don9of11Don9of11
    Posts: 340
    I listened to the audio sample you provided and I know it says "relaxed" but I think your tempo is too relaxed.
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  • Do you mean it to sound as if it were the celebration scene at the end of The Scarlet and the Black?
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    > I listened to the audio sample you provided and I know it says "relaxed" but I think your tempo is too relaxed.

    I slowed the sample down so it was easier to listen to the harmonies.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    I NEED AN OPINION

    I've composed the versicle.
    Thoughts?
    (ignore the time signatures)

    image
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    OH ALSO, you should totally program this for Easter
  • m. 7 to the end - consider switching alto and tenor.
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  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    > switching alto and tenor

    i definitely agree with this.

    ---
    BUT

    okay so i guess my big question here is:
    Is the key change just here at the end cheesy and on the nose, or is it - as i am hoping - a beautiful musical expression of Christ's rising, and a fitting end to the piece?
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    EASTER IS COMING
  • Adam,
    I haven't looked at in tremendously great detail, but it seems that the key change is gratuituous --- what you called "cheesy and on the nose". Mind you, the vertical presentation before the key change is jarring to my ear. Is this intentional?
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    It was just an idea that I thought was interesting at the time. I like it less now.
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 2,596
    Programming it for Eastertide this year---perhaps at May Crowning Mass.

    Also, is it possible to extract the Alleluia (quoting the [in]famous mode vi Antiphon) for use as the Communion Antiphon (or, rather, in my place, the Vespers Antiphon) at the Easter Vigil?
    Thanked by 1Adam Wood
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    Extract away!
    If you write or freshly arrange a tone for verses, please post it.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    Oh - and if there is any way you could make a recording of the whole piece, I would very much appreciate it.
  • matthewjmatthewj
    Posts: 2,641
    Where was this piece written?
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  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    On a piano in the lobby of building 1900 at the Googleplex, in the middle of the night.
  • chonakchonak
    Posts: 8,302
    The versicle is missing some words: "Quia surrexit Dominus vere, alleluia"
    Thanked by 2CHGiffen Adam Wood
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    This is true. Though I believe what I included is a complete and correct utterance in Latin.

    (Not that it matters, I don't think I like it.)
  • francisfrancis
    Posts: 8,815
    Am I mistaken or are you proposing an Eb in the upper part and a prolonged E natural in the bass line?
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    UPDATED:
    Here is a recording with actual singers.

    https://adammichaelwood.s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/regina-caeli-vocal-rough.mp3

    Also, ignore the antiphon stuff in the above comments.
  • mrcoppermrcopper
    Posts: 653
    The problem with the whole is found in the first two bars. Saying "relaxed" does not allow the composer to forgo being accurate and careful with the rhythm. When the voice parts differ, sometimes a decision is necessary: which voice part will the listener follow? Ignoring bar lines, just look at the soprano: is it really possible to sing re-gi-na-cael- LIIIIIIIIII! If you have the time and interest, perhaps starting with only one voice could work -- establish what you intend to do with the rhythm .. then be clear, when and if another voice contradicts the established agreement, let it be dramatic.


    Thanked by 1Adam Wood
  • mrcoppermrcopper
    Posts: 653
    something like this might work -- I'd want, given the alleluia following, TWO alleluias to give a balanced beginning!
    3635 x 868 - 26K
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  • Schönbergian
    Posts: 550
    I don't understand the basis of that critique - are you saying the verbal rhythm should be perfectly homophonic throughout?
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  • mrcoppermrcopper
    Posts: 653
    Not at all -- but that the individual part must be 'perfect' and the whole must be understandable.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    @mrcopper I deeply appreciate your engagement with the work.
    I do think I disagree with you here, though.

    As to your question
    > which voice part will the listener follow?

    My intention was the soprano, throughout.
    I described the intention to the performers as:

    > This is essentially a solo chant, with a choral accompaniment.

    As this was remotely recorded with two singers, I had the female singer sing the soprano line first, directing her to sing it (more or less) freely, and then has the other parts recorded (Bass first, then ten, then alto), fitting their performance to the "solo" soprano line.

    Two things I think might be militating against this intention:
    - the text setting, which perhaps I should have kept homophonic throughout
    - the sound mix on the above-posted track
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    Oh, also - did you like, generally?
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    is it really possible to sing re-gi-na-cael- LIIIIIIIIII!


    This is a direct quote:

    image
  • mrcoppermrcopper
    Posts: 653
    Well, bar lines do change things. In the recording, the soprano's "LI" fades away and the bass "NA" marks the bar ..
    Do you think the accented "GI" of "Regina" in your chant excerpt indicates a rhythmic accent, or a vowel pronunciation? In modern terms, it would look like a 3 4 bar with the second note as the second scale step and an unaccented neighbor, followed by another 3 4 bar with the "LI" of "Caeli" as an unaccented harmony tone with the "CAE" the accented appoggiatura. That interpretation supports the dot on the note .. but does not support a rhythmic accent.
    I'm not ignoring your question "do you like it?" but that's always a difficult question to answer .. I like bits of the melody and don't like that the setting seems sometimes to detract from the beauty of moments of melody or note combinations.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    the bar lines are for organizational purposes only, so a choir doesn't get lost (and so conductors without chant experience can conduct).
    the piece does not have a time signature, and should not be sung as if "downbeats" of measures are accented.
  • Adam WoodAdam Wood
    Posts: 6,345
    again I appreciate your engagement with my work, but I wonder if your contemporary-music context makes it difficult to get what I'm going for with the chant rhythm.

    honestly, I think I was successful (more or less) on what I was trying to do, and where I think I could use the most help/development as a composer is the harmony, and so would appreciate critique/advice on that aspect in particular. It is my weakest skill, and what I was attempting in this piece was really on the edge of what I am capable of.
  • francisfrancis
    Posts: 8,815
    so, i am still unclear... the upper voice has an e flat and the lower voice has an e natural, but that is not what is in the recording...????
  • SalieriSalieri
    Posts: 2,596
    About the barring: Where the difficulty seems to be is with the first two bars, after that you seem to be barring based on the musical-textual accents of the Soprano, but in the first two bars you go against the bar. I would suggest altering the barring there to match the rest of the piece, which will make the accents line up. Also, have you considered using Mensurstriche as is sometimes used in early music? This might also be a graphical solution.
  • Schönbergian
    Posts: 550
    Mensurstriche has never sat right with me. Hugo Distler's approach to this sort of notation might work better, Adam. If you're not familiar with his works, I can send them privately (still under copyright in the US, I believe)