Jeffrey Tucker - It's time to stop making things up
  • It's Time...

    [reposted and found today going around the internet again!]
  • Liam
    Posts: 3,419
    Just a note to other commenters: it's a post from September 2012.
    Thanked by 2CharlesW eft94530
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 9,285
    I wondered about that. The climate has changed since Pope Benedict retired. I am no longer fighting the "Propers" wars. I use them where and when I can, and don't worry about the rest, since I think Propers are often the least of our worries.

    We get those "wandering" musician workshop providers and facilitators, some sponsored by local churches or the diocese. The publishers are behind some others. I don't even post their notices and flyers any more, and don't attend any of their workshops.
    Thanked by 1ghmus7
  • francisfrancis
    Posts: 7,873
    ...and with the new MP, it's a clarion call that continually seems to fall on deaf ears.
  • Liam
    Posts: 3,419
    Charles

    The energy for the Propers wars seemed to be misplaced. It would have been better for that energy to have prioritized (1) presidential chant and singing of the Ordo, and (2) more particularly, better settings of the Ordinary for the congregation to join in. On point (1), the traditionally minded faced the same practical obstacle that reformists (at least in the US and much of the English-speaking world informed by Irish Low Mass praxis) did: getting celebrants to sing (whether vernacular to Latin) is a tricky business. I suspect the reason point Propers took priority over (2) is the practical reality is that church musicians - just like congregations - tend to mentally and emotionally prioritize that which changes every week over that which is perceived to be wallpaper. But, and this is my point (and I do have one), the Ordo/Ordinary is not the filler, it's the liturgical meat (the four hymn sandwich metaphor originated as a way to convey that idea by satirical reversal - the treatment of the four hymns as the substance of the Mass sandwich, when they are in fact the least substantial thing of the Mass), and should be the musical priority.

    Thus, the Propers war was in a way a continuity with the triaging that occurred in practice after the reforms: people engaged in a skewed prioritization.
  • Kathy
    Posts: 4,946
    I just had a reason for mentioning this article on another board, and thought I'd do so here as well. It's a low-initial-confrontation method of moving towards propers.

    http://www.chantcafe.com/2013/03/10-steps-to-gradual.html?m=1
    Thanked by 1Don9of11
  • melofluentmelofluent
    Posts: 4,159
    I'm so disappointed. The thread title suggested Jeffrey could've gone back to playing trombone in some Alabama parish praise band; he likes the modern NO, Mikey, he likes it!
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 9,285
    presidential chant and singing of the Ordo


    As an easterner, I have often wondered at priests who can't sing parts of the liturgy. In the east, a guy would not be ordained if he couldn't chant the liturgy - that goes for deacons, too. Some get extra seminary time until they learn.
  • Liam
    Posts: 3,419
    Well, you see, there's an unwritten but still powerful Prime Directive of The Mass: Thou Shalt Not Make It Longer Than Is Required for Validity and Liceity....
    Thanked by 1bdh
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 9,285
    Somewhere in the vaults of the Vatican there is an infallible pronouncement that mass must not be longer than 1 hour.
  • Liam
    Posts: 3,419
    1 hour? I remember former landlord complaining about Sunday Mass at the church around the block being that long. He loudly preferred the 30 minute Mass at a much larger church 2 miles away.
    Thanked by 1CHGiffen
  • CharlesW
    Posts: 9,285
    The full eastern liturgy runs close to 3 hours. What wimps these Latins are.
  • I believe that THE most important thing is the praise, worship and adoration of GOD through your ministry within the church. I leave the engagement and motivation to active participation of the congregation and others, to the intervention of the Holy Spirit who is far more able than myself.

    Seek GOD and His kingdom first and all else will be added unto you.
    Thanked by 2StephenMatthew bdh
  • I saw the title of this thread, thought it read "Jeffrey Quick - Time To Start Making Things Up", and I thought, oh goody, Jeff is composing again!
  • ghmus7
    Posts: 971
    It seems that there are some things in Catholic Musical Parish life that are now firmly entrenched, and are being accepted as normal practice:
    1. Repertoire is from GIA, OCP with an occasional chant.
    2. The norm is a 'ensemble' piano, with guitars, flute, electric bass, whatever have you (just bring your instrument and play)
    3. Organ is not the norm, if used, a poor instrument or played badly.
    4. Popular 'sacro-pop' style is the norm.
    5. Music is 'led' by a volunteer, or part time person.

    In my diocese, these are far and away, the norm.
  • Carol
    Posts: 310
    There is an article in the current edition of the OCP publication "Today's Liturgy" entitled "AITI- All Instruments All the Time" by Ken Canedo which advocates for having hymn arrangements vary their instrumentation. It also mentions that instrumental arrangements are for sale by OCP and other music publishers.

    At my parish, we are less contemporary than the above comment. We do have chanted ordinaries (ICEL) at times, depending upon the celebrant with a combination of part-time and volunteer accompanists. One interesting thing, our paid late 30's organist did not even know "O Lord I am Not Worthy."
  • melofluentmelofluent
    Posts: 4,159
    ghmus7 -

    I think that your new paradigm can be couched in a larger manner by the example of the Casey beatification in the Detroit archdiocese, both in repertoire and practice ( but not so much in Nashville.) Were superior "traditional" choral pieces and ordinaries, as well as contemporary songs used (Yes, Virginia, they do exist,) the coordinated use or organ/orchestra/ensemble and choir could be quite effective. The problem is and always has been since V2 that this "top-down" exemplar fails because of rank incompetence at most parishes.
  • incompetence and vincible ignorance
    Thanked by 2eft94530 bhcordova